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Thread: Change Fiery Assault from Elementalist please

  1. #1
    Ascendant Soul sky's Avatar
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    Default Change Fiery Assault from Elementalist please

    I'd actually never bothered using this spell in all my time playing because I was told it sucks. I just decided to train it up and try it out on a dummy. The actual spell is quite nice but there are so many drawbacks to make it veryyy bad.

    -Consumes charge

    -Has a cool-down (is this justified with charge consumption?)

    -Must remain stationary whilst casting

    - Hits very poorly. This is one of the bigger issues. Let's compare Fiery Assault to Firestorm from Pyromancer. One would assume that a spell with such short range, and a cool-down, and consumes charge it should hit much better than a similar channeled ability with no real costs and is spammable.

    On a combat dummy, with 1829 spellpower and only using spec specific buffs:

    Using the common Elementalist spec (51 ele 15 sc) my Fiery Assault ticks for 1089 per crit per second per target.

    However using Pyrolock (36 30) Fire storm hits for 1335 per second. Using a 51 Pyro spec it hits for 1286 per second.

    Note I also have 240 more spellpower whilst using Fiery Assault from my pet spellpower buff..

    Am I mistaken for thinking such a niche ability from Elementalist should be hitting higher AoE damage than a spammable AoE from a primarily single target soul?

    My fixes:

    -Make Fiery Assault able to be channeled whilst moving. I.e. it would function similarly to Strafe from the Marksman soul.
    -Remove cool-down since charge is already a limiting factor
    -Up the spellpower coefficient a ton (though this is an issue for most of the Elementalist soul)
    - Make Fiery Assault a root ability & replace the tree talent with ''Upgraded Fiery Assault - Renders the Mage immune to all control and movement impairing effects whilst channelling Fiery Assault''

    Any thoughts?
    Last edited by Soul sky; 02-24-2012 at 06:01 PM.
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  2. #2
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    You forgot that elementalist also has 30% crit bonus... so as bad as your crit numbers look vs firestorm, your non-crit numbers are gonna be significantly worse.

    The main thing going for fiery assault used to be that it discharges its dmg quickly.... back when firestorm used to tick more slowly, but even then, it didn't make up for the dmg.

    All your suggestions are decent, although I would like the range to be slightly bigger as well.

    Elementalist tree needs quite a bit of work though.... I would like to see changes that make it such that 3x ele is still a viable choice..... elemental fury needs to be way lower down (eg. lvl 20), but make the +SP bonus much less per level after 20 (and the same as at lvl 51). Icy carapace still needs fixing. Fire elementals should benefit from intensify elements (which incidentally should last longer.... its a pretty weak 31 pt skill). Elemental armor needs to be better for a 44 pt'er.... the slew of skills useful only in PvP should actually be useful for PvP. And the darn greater elementals need to hit for something that's a bit more worth the mana/time summoning them.

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    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by masakari81 View Post
    Elemental armor needs to be better for a 44 pt'er....
    I've a few issues with your post but this is the most glaring:

    15% Bonus damage(without the Nyx's crystal) on it's own would be a great buff (see Glyphs of power...talented), 15% bonus charge on it's own would be a great buff (see Affinity in warlock), the extra armor is kinda meh, but when solo has it's uses. Add the three together in ONE armor spell and that's a pretty sick buff imho. The problem isn't the buff itself, it's the rest of the tree not scaling well. Icy Carapace (a would be awesome mechanic) is very underpowered, to the tune of being a solid DPS loss to cast in any situation. There is a very minor change that can be made that would actually put Elemental DPS on par with other specs; Remove Abrasion and replace it with a Linked-to-Icy Carapace tree ability called Improved Icy Carapace: Gives your Icy Carapace a 50/100% to not be consumed when the enemy is stuck by an earth spell.

    Coupled with the change on the PTS this would give (in my gear at least) a roughly 500-700 dps increase (which would put 51 elemental on par with other specs). To avoid...abuse in PvP simply word it so that the talent doesn't work in PvP, and viola 51 elemental is a viable, competitive DPS spec.

    Intesify Elements is a perfect 31 point ability. 15 seconds of very very strong damage for you and your pet, which if timed properly will carry another 15 seconds or so for certain spells (Elemental Forces, Icy Carapace, Ignite).

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    Quote Originally Posted by LatsyrcMoy View Post
    I've a few issues with your post but this is the most glaring:

    15% Bonus damage(without the Nyx's crystal) on it's own would be a great buff (see Glyphs of power...talented), 15% bonus charge on it's own would be a great buff (see Affinity in warlock), the extra armor is kinda meh, but when solo has it's uses. Add the three together in ONE armor spell and that's a pretty sick buff imho. The problem isn't the buff itself, it's the rest of the tree not scaling well. Icy Carapace (a would be awesome mechanic) is very underpowered, to the tune of being a solid DPS loss to cast in any situation. There is a very minor change that can be made that would actually put Elemental DPS on par with other specs; Remove Abrasion and replace it with a Linked-to-Icy Carapace tree ability called Improved Icy Carapace: Gives your Icy Carapace a 50/100% to not be consumed when the enemy is stuck by an earth spell.

    Coupled with the change on the PTS this would give (in my gear at least) a roughly 500-700 dps increase (which would put 51 elemental on par with other specs). To avoid...abuse in PvP simply word it so that the talent doesn't work in PvP, and viola 51 elemental is a viable, competitive DPS spec.

    Intesify Elements is a perfect 31 point ability. 15 seconds of very very strong damage for you and your pet, which if timed properly will carry another 15 seconds or so for certain spells (Elemental Forces, Icy Carapace, Ignite).

    Except improved glyphs is at lvl 30 and affinity at lvl 5 and armor is useless in PvE... if you're hit as a mage, you're dead. And if you look at the individual coefficients of spells, elementalist is actually not bad. It just doesn't have enough +% skills in the tree.... the only one being elemental armor... which at 44pts is just poor.

    Intensify is sad unless used with heatwave. You can use all the spells you wan't. No ele parse has been worth its weight in any scenario (pvp or raid). I love the ele concept, but as it stands, the soul is a bit too sad, and the SP buff from elemental fury was a bad idea in that it just gives a once off boost with no scaling whatsoever.

  5. #5
    General of Telara Relair's Avatar
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    Yeah fiery assault needs to be the crown jewel of elementalist damage, its one of the only unique spells they have. Theres already plenty of good charge dumps with ele forces and mana regen, make it 0 charge and 15s cd, or make it keep using charge with no cooldown. Either way bump up its dmg so its at least equal to if not greater than firestorm spam.

  6. #6
    Rqp
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    Yep, this spell is totaly broken, mages have few spells that should never be used if you want to be good at what u do: fiery assult, draining bolt, Withering Vine, Empty the Crypts, Vile Spores if deep chloromancer, Neddra's Torture.

    Seriously, would any1 care if these spells will be removed?

  7. #7
    General of Telara Relair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rqp View Post
    Yep, this spell is totaly broken, mages have few spells that should never be used if you want to be good at what u do: fiery assult, draining bolt, Withering Vine, Empty the Crypts, Vile Spores if deep chloromancer, Neddra's Torture.

    Seriously, would any1 care if these spells will be removed?
    EtC is actually a decent dps gain for 51 necro...of course a decent gain for crap overall dps still sucks. The whole soul needs a big boost, making EtC do more dmg would be a nice start.

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    In fact I think making EtC summon skeleton archers instead of melees would help, half their time is spent trying to run to the damn target, by the time they get there its almost time for them to poof. Maybe get rid of detonate bones and put in a talent that makes your crits have like a 25% chance to reset the cd and make instant cast your next EtC too or something.
    Last edited by Relair; 02-28-2012 at 09:06 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Relair View Post
    In fact I think making EtC summon skeleton archers instead of melees would help, half their time is spent trying to run to the damn target, by the time they get there its almost time for them to poof. Maybe get rid of detonate bones and put in a talent that makes your crits have like a 25% chance to reset the cd and make instant cast your next EtC too or something.
    Woah I like this. Only problem is it would take away the swarming feel of the Necromancer's undead army if they were archers. Would be very nice to get another version of empty the crypts to combine it though, say as a second 44-51 point ability to combine with Empty the crypt. Cool-down on new ability could be adjusted to make Necro a considered option to raiders again :P

    Originally Posted by Rqp
    Yep, this spell is totaly broken, mages have few spells that should never be used if you want to be good at what u do: fiery assult, draining bolt, Withering Vine, Empty the Crypts, Vile Spores if deep chloromancer, Neddra's Torture.

    Seriously, would any1 care if these spells will be removed?
    Got to disagree on draining bolt. I spec it in 38 28 Defilemancer (it's a free point, only 2% hitpoints loss). I use it perhaps only once per boss sometimes, but damn it SAVES me from losing a lot of DPS. Reasons like: Oh damn, Murdantix knocked me back. All of my DoTs are up, flame bolt is on cool-down and I'm running back to Murdantix with no instant available and I'm about to lose my Defile. Draining bolt is a good movement spell and emergency charge giver which in very few situations beats using up your last 5 charge clipping a DoT or otherwise trying to cast fireball and losing Defile.

    PS EtC is a DPS gain in Necrolock specs for solo'ing (and pre 1.6 raiding Mages), and draining bolt is more DPS than void bolt (at least below Void decimation) so they're not that bad

    As for Firey Assault. I guess I'd just like it to have at least a factor that would make people consider putting a point into it in some future hybrid elementalist build, just like I do with draining bolt in warlock. This could be by making it offer synergy to another soul with some sort of bonus effect, or simply making it a more of a signature talent of its spec.
    Valery@Zaviel - Mage | Valzz - Cleric | Soulsky - Rogue | Introvert - Warrior
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