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Thread: Elementalist 51pt Build

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    Default Elementalist 51pt Build

    I remember seeing a post quite a long time ago detailing a (supposedly) viable 51pt elementalist build that was supposed to be good all the way thru level 50, but I haven't seen anybody mention anything like that in a long time. Is that no longer a viable option for PvE, or is that still a good build

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    Ascendant Aguni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tierr View Post
    I remember seeing a post quite a long time ago detailing a (supposedly) viable 51pt elementalist build that was supposed to be good all the way thru level 50, but I haven't seen anybody mention anything like that in a long time. Is that no longer a viable option for PvE, or is that still a good build
    Its good for leveling and soloing.
    It is bad for dungeons/raids since the DPS is relatively poor compared to every other calling.

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    General of Telara Relair's Avatar
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    Its actually quite good for soloing, you can kill anything but a raid boss by yourself once you get the improved pet heal talent. And its good for new or undergeared lvl 50's because of the huge spellpower bonus you get. For doing t2's and beginner raids like DH, GSB, etc its quite decent, just go 51ele 15sc for some aoe and use the water pet on single target and air on aoe fights. It just has this stigma of being awful but before you are all decked out in epics and relics you can do as much or more dps as the cookie cutter pyro specs with a far easier rotation. Of course once you get good gear it has the same problem as all pet specs, it scales like sh*t with gear. So pyro/locks quickly overtake it the better geared you get. Shameless plug: Trion for the love of god fix pet scaling, we don't all want to play a freaking pyro you know!
    Last edited by Relair; 02-19-2012 at 09:03 PM.

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    RIFT Community Ambassador bluedot's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relair View Post
    Its actually quite good for solo and for new or undergeared lvl 50's because of the huge spellpower bonus you get. For doing t2's and beginner raids like DH, GSB, etc its quite decent, just go 51ele 15sc for some aoe and use the water pet on single target and air on aoe fights. It just has this stigma of being awful but before you are all decked out in epics and relics you can do as much or more dps as the cookie cutter pyro specs with a far easier rotation. Of course once you get good gear it has the same problem as all pet specs, it scales like sh*t with gear. So pyro/locks quickly overtake it the better geared you get. Shameless plug: Trion for the love of god fix pet scaling, we don't all want to play a freaking pyro you know!
    This^^
    Its one of the best builds for a brand new 50 to take into a raid. This window of opportunity is narrowed by the streamlined gearing process, but its still a good build to keep in mind.

    Also you can solo 5mans when you are decked out in Relics

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    Ascendant Aguni's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relair View Post
    snip
    Not true at all.
    It at first will appear to scale well due tot he SP buff but otherwise, other specs beat it due to scaling bette.r
    Heck with thamaturge or even planar gear you're set ahead of 51 elementalist.

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    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    Default 51 ele is too much fun...

    That's why I'm playing advocate for the spec.

    While 51/15 Ele/SC is decent Aoe I find that 51/15 Ele Pyro is actually pretty strong and almost competitive Single target DPS in raids. I'll probably be flamed here for my choices in the spec but whatevs:

    Reasoning behind 15 pyro vs 15 SC:
    Pyro Pro's/cons:
    Pro:
    +10% all spell damage
    +5% Fire damage (affects Fire Ele's and Ignite, not sure about elemental forces)
    +mana regen
    +cast time push back resistance
    +10% stacking crit when you don't crit (normally only has 1 stack)
    +10 charge (roughly 3 seconds of EF)
    +Flicker (giving 3x "break free" abilities)
    +5% casting haste (doesn't make or break things, just a quality of life improvement for higher latency)
    +2nd shield when needed
    Con:
    -5% more damage taken
    -Must be standing still to get the +10% damage bonus

    Storm Caller Pros/Cons:
    Pro:
    +Much better AOE abilities
    +10% Crit to Air Spells
    +5% Damage to Air Spells
    +10% less cost of Air Spells
    +push back resist on AOE casts
    +Icy Vortex (25% Damage redux + Hypothermia if hit)
    Cons:
    None really

    I can see an argument to keeping both truthfully, but I only DPS when someone really really wants to archon that night/in t2's

    Also, could someone explain why the Water elemental is better dps single target than the Air? I've yet to find a place where the Water ele out dps' the Air ele.

    With the Nyx's Elemental crystal Crystaline missles becomes and extremely strong Nuke for having only a ~1.5 casting time (I see crits of upwards of 2500 in a raid setting), and having Lightning Strike on a 1.5s cast time makes it a very strong ability (thing Cinder Burst levels of damage). My only real problem with the spec is that Icy Carapace is always a DPS loss.

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    Sword of Telara meoka2368's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LatsyrcMoy View Post
    Also, could someone explain why the Water elemental is better dps single target than the Air? I've yet to find a place where the Water ele out dps' the Air ele.
    Look at the first ability for each pet. The water one does more base damage. As soon as you get into multiple targets, however, the air pet is better.
    If you really want to get more DPS out of the water pet, turn off the auto cast on the CC abilities.

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    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    Look at the first ability for each pet. The water one does more base damage. As soon as you get into multiple targets, however, the air pet is better.
    If you really want to get more DPS out of the water pet, turn off the auto cast on the CC abilities.
    I checked them, but never mathed em before. It's a difference of something like 12dps in favor of the water ele in my gear. I s'pose in theory the Water Ele wins, but not by enough to matter to really matter

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    I think one of the main points for going SC is to get Storm Shard, which gives you that free Icicle crit after casting Lightning Strike. Its indeed a nice, hard hitting spell (about 2.3-2.4k a hit). However, when I tried this it didn't work out as well as pyro, mainly for two reasons: you miss the +10% damage from glyphs, and you also miss the mana regen. With points in SC, I regularly run empty in parses, and have to use mana pots or spend time channeling mana regen. And I STILL get lower DPS overall. So I too think pyro is the best soul to add to the elem. I'd not use the pyro root tho...better to put the last point(s) into archon +fire damage

    Btw. LatsyrcMoy: what kind of DPS do you get as elem? See so few parses, and would like to compare!

    5% casting haste (doesn't make or break things, just a quality of life improvement for higher latency)
    This also works wonderfully together with Burning Ground
    Last edited by Sarim; 02-20-2012 at 11:54 PM.

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    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    I've only been able to run it once or twice in a Raid but I was hitting ~2k last night (and steadily climbing but then the tank ate a very very large hit and they asked me to archon for some strange reason). I can push it as high as 2500 without any weird boss mechanics boosting it though. I'll ask to dps this week so I can get a good average

    Also, I'm a believer with the water pet now. It's only 12 dps on paper but it ends up being much much more than that(Pyro haste affects the pets too!)
    Last edited by LatsyrcMoy; 02-21-2012 at 09:19 AM.

  11. #11
    General of Telara Relair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LatsyrcMoy View Post
    I've only been able to run it once or twice in a Raid but I was hitting ~2k last night (and steadily climbing but then the tank ate a very very large hit and they asked me to archon for some strange reason). I can push it as high as 2500 without any weird boss mechanics boosting it though. I'll ask to dps this week so I can get a good average

    Also, I'm a believer with the water pet now. It's only 12 dps on paper but it ends up being much much more than that(Pyro haste affects the pets too!)
    The water haste from SC gets the water pets cast time down to 1.6s with no other buffs, seems like that would increase its dps quite a bit.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by LatsyrcMoy View Post
    I've only been able to run it once or twice in a Raid but I was hitting ~2k last night (and steadily climbing but then the tank ate a very very large hit and they asked me to archon for some strange reason). I can push it as high as 2500 without any weird boss mechanics boosting it though. I'll ask to dps this week so I can get a good average

    Also, I'm a believer with the water pet now. It's only 12 dps on paper but it ends up being much much more than that(Pyro haste affects the pets too!)
    That seems consistent with my experience, my best also has been ~2.5k (on Matron). Seems we're in a similar position, I also rarely get to DPS as I'm mostly playing archon.

    I still don't think the haste talents have any effect on the pets tho. If I find time I'll make a longer test today to find out more
    Last edited by Sarim; 02-21-2012 at 11:56 PM.

  13. #13
    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relair View Post
    The water haste from SC gets the water pets cast time down to 1.6s with no other buffs, seems like that would increase its dps quite a bit.
    Thanks for that tidbit. I'll have to look at that too. Possibly a 10sc/5pyro spec to make the most of it.

  14. #14
    Rift Chaser LatsyrcMoy's Avatar
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    Just did some testing:

    10 sc 5 pyro (Pet Haste 25%)
    Time: 05:00
    DPS :1296
    40% Crystaline Missiles - 518.4
    27% Ice Bolt (Pet) - 349.92
    17% Lightning Strike
    8% Ignite
    7% Elemental Forces
    2% Forlorn Crystal

    9sc 6 Pyro (Pet haste 21%):
    Time: 05:00
    DPS: 1490
    41% Crystaline Missiles - 610.9
    24% Ice Bolt (pet) - 357.6
    17% Lightning Strike
    9% Ignite
    2% Forlorn Crystal

    15 pyro 0 archon (Pet haste 5%)
    DPS: 1532
    44% Crystaline Missiles - 674.08
    23% Ice Bolt - 352.36
    16% Lightning Strike
    8% Ignite
    7% Elemental Forces
    1% Forlorn Crystal

    In all cases Swarming flames were used as close to the 0, 2 minute, and 4 minute marks as possible. No debuffs were used, and the only buffs used were those I could supply myself (Pillaging stone etc.) Something fun, with the second spec CM was critting for exactly 2k.
    Last edited by LatsyrcMoy; 02-22-2012 at 11:33 AM.

  15. #15
    General of Telara Relair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LatsyrcMoy View Post
    Just did some testing:

    10 sc 5 pyro (Pet Haste 25%)
    Time: 05:00
    DPS :1296
    40% Crystaline Missiles - 518.4
    27% Ice Bolt (Pet) - 349.92
    17% Lightning Strike
    8% Ignite
    7% Elemental Forces
    2% Forlorn Crystal

    9sc 6 Pyro (Pet haste 21%):
    Time: 05:00
    DPS: 1490
    41% Crystaline Missiles - 610.9
    24% Ice Bolt (pet) - 357.6
    17% Lightning Strike
    9% Ignite
    2% Forlorn Crystal

    15 pyro 0 archon (Pet haste 5%)
    DPS: 1532
    44% Crystaline Missiles - 674.08
    23% Ice Bolt - 352.36
    16% Lightning Strike
    8% Ignite
    7% Elemental Forces
    1% Forlorn Crystal

    In all cases Swarming flames were used as close to the 0, 2 minute, and 4 minute marks as possible. No debuffs were used, and the only buffs used were those I could supply myself (Pillaging stone etc.) Something fun, with the second spec CM was critting for exactly 2k.
    That is so weird, you'd think that much haste would increase water pets dps substantially..maybe its just a tooltip bug and doesnt actually affect it?

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