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Thread: Searching for a ele/sc build for pvp only

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    Rift Disciple Seriisbad's Avatar
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    Default Searching for a ele/sc build for pvp only

    any suggestions? a guide would be great
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    Prophet of Telara Corian's Avatar
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    Check here but keep in mind that I haven't tested it extensively.

    It seems like it does okay but you may want to tweak it some to taste. If you don't have PvP rank 4, you can go 38 elementalist instead for sever bonds, then use warlock instead of archmage as your third soul for opportunity or whatever.

    It's a starting point though.
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    SC Ele is not too great for PvP. You do a lot of damage, but have zero survivability... THE glass cannon of mages that's more like a raid spec.

    I know this, because when I queue up in a wf after doing some PvE, and run off into battle still blazing my SC/ELE accidently, anybody focuses on me I just keel over and die.

    Experiment with SC and Dom, or SC and Necro for PvP, you'll see a lot of success there more than w\Ele.
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    lgw
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    SC / Ele is perfectly fine for PVP, and among the best burst and damage specs, and is still relatively durable provided you have about anyone healing you.
    Although it really begins to shine at P4, when you can trade Tempest for Overload, and thus save a lot of semi-good points in the middle of Ele. Have a look at the burst spec I mentioned in my little PVP spec overview.
    Last edited by lgw; 07-13-2011 at 06:02 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgw View Post
    SC / Ele is perfectly fine for PVP, and among the best burst and damage specs, and is still relatively durable provided you have about anyone healing you.
    Although it really begins to shine at P4, when you can trade Tempest for Overload, and thus save a lot of semi-good points in the middle of Ele. Have a look at the burst spec I mentioned in my little PVP spec overview.
    This class is only good if you are standing behind everyone, and are blindsiding unaware people with high DPS, but that goes for any raid build in PvP. That's all it's good for. You have zero defenses. Which is why at end game, it's not common to play it

    Against other classes in mages, you are in an uphill battle just by design.
    Pyros will just initially outburst you because unlike you, they don't require stacking a bunch of charges to get high initial burst DPS. SC/Dom can destroy your cast time you need for your big burst spells, and then reflect them back at you, interrupting everything else, with your pet cc'd the entire time it takes to kill you. Even semi-talented full dominators can render most mage classes completely useless for many reasons.

    If you like dying a lot, but putting up good DPS the times you walk around unnoticed or targetted, play it. Other than that, pair SC with Dom, necro, or lock and by design you'll be more versatile.
    Last edited by Menaace; 07-13-2011 at 08:52 AM.
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    lgw
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menaace View Post
    This class is only good if you are standing behind everyone, and are blindsiding unaware people with high DPS, but that goes for any raid build in PvP. That's all it's good for. You have zero defenses. Which is why at end game, it's not common to play it
    If you're talking about 32/32 SC/Ele, maybe. But nobody in their right mind would suggest that for any serious PVP - nor did I.

    My suggested build has:
    * -10% incoming dmg total
    * -12-15% crits taken
    * 4 strong defensive CDs between 30s und 1min (plus option to get Hastened Withdrawel for kiting)
    So as long as you have even a single semicompetent healer around (good Bard, a Cleric/Chloro who's able to push Healing Breath / Bloom in between AOE spams), you're quite hard to bring down.

    Against other classes in mages, you are in an uphill battle just by design.
    Pyros will just initially outburst you because unlike you, they don't require stacking a bunch of charges to get high initial burst DPS. SC/Dom can destroy your cast time you need for your big burst spells, and then reflect them back at you, interrupting everything else, with your pet cc'd the entire time it takes to kill you. Even semi-talented full dominators can render most mage classes completely useless for many reasons.
    Pyros have cast times, too, and as long as I have any of Raging Storm / Electrocute / Lightning Storm ready, he better have full charge, Heat Wave or a good healer nearby.
    Plus I don't use any cast spells, and my only single target that can be reflected / converted is IS, which doens't matter at all. And your happy Pyro suffers much worse from it.

    If you like dying a lot, but putting up good DPS the times you walk around unnoticed or targetted, play it. Other than that, pair SC with Dom, necro, or lock and by design you'll be more versatile.
    BS. As above, this has among to best surviability and is the only cast spells the spec uses are the two occasional big nukes two break through some spamhealed P6.
    Dom/SC is much squishier, Dom/Lock largely dependent on two 3min CDs, Dom/Necro has bad selfheals and is Charge starved. The only competative option is SC/Lock, what that gets as CDs, the SC/Ele/AM has almost permanently on.
    Last edited by lgw; 07-14-2011 at 03:20 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by lgw View Post
    If you're talking about 32/32 SC/Ele, maybe. But nobody in their right mind would suggest that for any serious PVP - nor did I.

    My suggested build has:
    * -10% incoming dmg total
    * -12-15% crits taken
    * 4 strong defensive CDs between 30s und 1min (plus option to get Hastened Withdrawel for kiting)
    So as long as you have even a single semicompetent healer around (good Bard, a Cleric/Chloro who's able to push Healing Breath / Bloom in between AOE spams), you're quite hard to bring down.

    Plus I don't use any cast spells, and my only single target that can be reflected / converted is IS, which doens't matter at all. And your happy Pyro suffers much worse from it.
    Nothing you mentioned points survivability to me other than your saying that with pocket healers you will survive. In that, you can't solo PvP. Which agrees with what I said. It's good if you stand back, WAY back, and they are bad and bunch up under your obviously placed storm cloud.

    PvP's about control, not about DPS. But if you want to equate it to DPS, then I'll bite. Against other mages in the DPS category: NecroLock and PyroEle has more single target dps than a SC/Ele... by a longshot, any raider will tell you this. Secondly, if a SC/Ele fight at best, is a dps race against someone else. That "someone else" can be a rogue who can stunlock, warrior can silence, or mage who can cc/reflect chomp away all of your mana, and confuse you... WHILE they DPS you and heal themselves. How do you fight against a SC/Dom? A full warden? Or MM hybrid? I'd like to know just maybe so I can learn something I might not know about Sc/Ele.
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    For PVP you need:

    1. Burst
    2. Survivability
    3. Control
    4. Mobility

    In today's environment, without pairing souls with either chloro,dom, or warlock it's virtually impossible to outlast a healer, or survive a warrior/rogue opening on you.

    Viable PVP Specs:

    Durable and independant:

    Chloro/Dom
    Dom/Chloro
    Chloro/Lock
    Lock/Chloro
    51 chloro

    You better have your two defensive CD's up:

    Necro/Lock
    Lock/Necro
    51 lock

    You better open on them, before they open on you:

    Pyro/Dom
    SC/Dom
    51 dom

    Anything outside of the "durable independent" group and you're going to have alot of WTF moments.
    Last edited by Pyrial; 07-14-2011 at 10:00 AM.

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    lgw
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    Quote Originally Posted by Menaace View Post
    Nothing you mentioned points survivability to me other than your saying that with pocket healers you will survive. In that, you can't solo PvP. Which agrees with what I said. It's good if you stand back, WAY back, and they are bad and bunch up under your obviously placed storm cloud.
    1) Bard AOE drippling heals very much =/= pocket healer.
    2) Only a fool places clouds over the enemy team. You place them over chokes, over healers to force them to come closer, over objectives or best over your own ranged group to melt their melees. Plus you have Hailstorm. Plus Forked / LF is player targeted.
    3) Nobody except you asked for solo PVP. The spec is still quite useable there, btw, but I'll leave that branch as there are, without doubt, better surviability specs. Just for you: Over 90% of PVP is not 1on1.

    PvP's about control, not about DPS. But if you want to equate it to DPS, then I'll bite. Against other mages in the DPS category: NecroLock and PyroEle has more single target dps than a SC/Ele... by a longshot, any raider will tell you this. Secondly, if a SC/Ele fight at best, is a dps race against someone else. That "someone else" can be a rogue who can stunlock, warrior can silence, or mage who can cc/reflect chomp away all of your mana, and confuse you... WHILE they DPS you and heal themselves. How do you fight against a SC/Dom? A full warden? Or MM hybrid? I'd like to know just maybe so I can learn something I might not know about Sc/Ele.
    PVP is about burst, and this spec is absolutely among the top burst specs, especially if you talk about the ability to apply it consistenly to any target, on low CDs and the ability to still survive. Sustained DPS is only relevant in AOE situations (Scion bridge), to forced their healers OOM or make them unable to spotheal due general pressure.
    32 SC / 20 AM / 14 Ele has +15-25% crit chance, +30% crit damage, more on its big nukes - if that ain't burst IDK. Elec is applied via AOE (if dispelled - hey, who cares - you just buffered a more important debuff of somebody else) or as burst via Raging and the like. Then you can just spam LF, add an instant IS angainst hard target if it pleases you, and only ever cast to spike with LF or BS+AB against someone getting spamhealed. In case you eat a rupt, Double Tap makes recasting a non-issue.
    PVP doesn't happen in a vacuum or a featureless, empty room. Go out and run the spec - it performs very well in both theorycraft and practise.

    ... same stuff applies to Pyrial's reply as well.
    Last edited by lgw; 07-15-2011 at 03:58 AM.
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    Plane Walker
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    sorry yo but anything rolling SC/ele in pvp is a free kill, also anything past 5 in archmage, cept for maybe Chloro is also just dumb. I wont take the time to argue a point as im sure you are stuck and your ways and you have to right to play what you think is right. all i ask is that you please dont spread the bad ideas to more mages so we have even more QQ theads down the road. Oh and maybe more in archmage if your doing your quest thinger for whitefall carrying flags. Thats all, anytime else its worthless and a waste of points.

    Also SC ele isnt the most burst in PVP now, maybe a few months back but now, just no. The learning curve has caught up and ppl will just cleanse your electrified stacks, to the point where the best you can do is spam you "rev up" spells. This and generally you wont be left alone why your raining lighting from the sky, ppl have come to learn lol. hastened withdrawal isnt helping you for one, and -15% crit isnt doing much either. SC anything needs a pocket healer to be effective in PVP, SC/ele just makes it that much more needed.

    And anything defensive that you get from ELE is just overshadowed by the fact that you are specced into ELE in the first place. Have fun on the rez pad.
    Last edited by Queezy; 07-15-2011 at 04:23 AM.

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    Anything that isn't coupled with either Dom, Lock, or Chloro currently isn't going to work. Unless, you plan on running with friends or a pocket healer.

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    Sorry for jumping into a mage thread but had to put my little warrior cry in.

    Welcome to the world of the warrior people keep crying about. This game is about Huge dps/burst and your best buddy the pocket healer. if you want to go running around on your own like the good old S/B warrior we all love and ignore. then feel free, but PvP is NOT 1v1. Usually its 3v1 of 4v1 if your unlucky like me and get caught out in the open. In any situation where you find yourself alone you better pray you got a Team Mate coming round the corner pretty soon.

    Although i will admit if you want 1V1 combat go sit at the vault in Codex it happens there... only there but there.
    BEST QUOTE EVER

    Yeah, I love it when warriors stand there and say 'just kill me' and I'm forced to say 'well actually, this will go a LOT faster if you move and try and fight back . . . we'll be ehre all day if you just stand there like that *winds up another 300hit vile spores*.'

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    Quote Originally Posted by Virinda View Post
    Sorry for jumping into a mage thread but had to put my little warrior cry in.

    Welcome to the world of the warrior people keep crying about. This game is about Huge dps/burst and your best buddy the pocket healer. if you want to go running around on your own like the good old S/B warrior we all love and ignore. then feel free, but PvP is NOT 1v1. Usually its 3v1 of 4v1 if your unlucky like me and get caught out in the open. In any situation where you find yourself alone you better pray you got a Team Mate coming round the corner pretty soon.

    Although i will admit if you want 1V1 combat go sit at the vault in Codex it happens there... only there but there.
    The differences between the burst specs of mages and warrriors is, as a warrior you're going to win those 1 v 1's. That's why the mage's burst specs don't work at all unless accompanied by a healer. They don't do enough burst and have 0 survivability. You'll be dropped in the span of a silence or stun as a burst spec'd mage.
    Last edited by Pyrial; 07-15-2011 at 04:53 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lgw View Post
    1) Bard AOE drippling heals very much =/= pocket healer.
    3) Nobody except you asked for solo PVP.
    Again.. your survivability is "pocket healer" and you just admitted that you can't 1v1 anyone. Nobody's being mean, it's just that we are both agreeing on what you are saying. And like I read here, Dom is a can do twice as much effective damage against a team:
    - Priest's Lament on Healer (silences himself 60% the time), Accelerated decay (-25% cast speed)
    - Incompetence on each healer there (their healers heal you now)
    - Void Shroud (any target you are fighting receives half heals)
    - I'll, stop here.. but without control, DPS will not beat healers, not in this game.

    Quote Originally Posted by lgw View Post
    PVP is about burst
    Wrong, PvP is about objectives in a gametype, which require as everyone else is saying, survivability

    Quote Originally Posted by lgw View Post
    32 SC / 20 AM / 14 Ele has +15-25% crit chance, +30% crit damage, more on its big nukes - if that ain't burst IDK. PVP doesn't happen in a vacuum or a featureless, empty room. Go out and run the spec - it performs very well in both theorycraft and practise.
    I do play the spec, in raids. And when I forget to switch it accidently after joining a wf, I realize that I'm useless when I get there. I die, and switch back to my Sc/Dom on the rez pad. A mage with a tornado following him around gets a big giant "1" over his head by most teams, as he's 2-shot fodder for any melee.

    Also, you don't know the power of heals in this game, because you can't burst through a good team of healers. I would choose squirreling a healer and silencing a second one, over trying to burst your 1 point of damage to their 2 points heals anyday.

    But I mean, to each his own, if you like playing that, nothing wrong with it. But you recommended it to someone who was asking about the class, and a lot of the mage community is waving red flags to say no, because it's only good in a very controlled situation, i.e. the "Vacuum" that you yourself mentioned, where you yourself has a wall of healers as well; whereas other classes are so much much much more versatile in multiple situations.
    Last edited by Menaace; 07-15-2011 at 08:12 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pyrial View Post
    Anything that isn't coupled with either Dom, Lock, or Chloro currently isn't going to work. Unless, you plan on running with friends or a pocket healer.
    ^Emphasized
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