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Thread: Are Pyros free kills now in warfronts?

  1. #1
    Telaran
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    Default Are Pyros free kills now in warfronts?

    Prelude: I am a 50 mage PVPing in 43 Pyro/8Chloro/15Archmage spec. I'm only rank 3 with 338 Valor (13.5% pvp dmg reduction). My gear is t2 where it is not pvp gear; 836 spell power, 553 crit.

    I really like the pyro class, but things just aren't right in PVP at the moment. My best bet in any BG is to go in behind everyone and try desperately to fireball someone down using heatwave whenever it's up, flame bolt/ground of power for extra fire dmg, and any procs for cinderburst as they come up. However I constantly fail to kill anyone, especially healers, using this method of DPSing as I am hitting for ~400-500 non crit fireballs (coming out every 2 seconds, 1 sec with heatwave) and I'm hitting for 900 with cinderburst.

    Now I understand that my gear isn't that ideal, but this is ridiculously low damage compared to how people can damage me. I'm sitting at 3963hp (thank you -9% hp from pyro tree) and my best bet if anyone starts to target me in a warfront is to pop runeshield/burning shield if i can, bloom if i can, and flicker away if i can. If half of those aren't up I'm dead in 2-3 seconds (less if it's more than one person on me).

    Some will say to use kiting abilities/cc abilities. Our choices as pyro is our 5 second stun (2 second self stun), 8 second 90% movement slow, 8 second root. Those all sound pretty good on paper, but very poor in actuality. Diminishing returns are the bane to all these abilities. The stun will stun you and the other person will have a diminished effect stunning the person for the same amount of time that you're stunned for. Sometimes they're immune to stuns as they run up to you and you try to stun them and it essentially stuns yourself leaving them free to whack on you. A CC ability that essentially works against you in a lot of situations! The root/slow is also on the same diminishing return giving you hardly any time to run away(often the best bet) let alone try to kill them.

    This post is not to comment on the recent pyro nerfs, but more to just give feedback on how the pyro class feels to me given my current gear/spec. The only way I can play Pyro without a major death fest is to try and not get seen, running away if I do. This playstyle feels very underwhelming to me and I would like to see Pyros be able to do a little more than that in pvp.

  2. #2
    Prophet of Telara Corian's Avatar
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    anything you play with a bad spec and rank 3 is going to feel useless

    that said pyro needs either its burst back, mobility, or survivability

    it has none of the above atm
    This is why we can't have nice things.

  3. #3
    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corian View Post
    anything you play with a bad spec and rank 3 is going to feel useless

    that said pyro needs either its burst back, mobility, or survivability

    it has none of the above atm
    IMO pyro needs:
    Engulfing flames
    1 min cool down
    Reduce all damage by 75% for the next 8 seconds and become immune to silence and knockback.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by brutis View Post
    IMO pyro needs:
    Engulfing flames
    1 min cool down
    Reduce all damage by 75% for the next 8 seconds and become immune to silence and knockback.
    Why don't we add stealth and slip away while we're at it?

  5. #5
    Champion of Telara Silverangel69's Avatar
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    I can just say that *my* r2 pyro with 3600ish health is a free kill in a WF. I use flicker to run and burning bonds, but people just break it, chase me, and once they catch up, it's over. I bugged Ignition because I don't think it's even working with Fireball. Imp Void Bolt is working, but Ignition isn't.

  6. #6
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by jMerliN View Post
    Why don't we add stealth and slip away while we're at it?
    because then mages would be on par with rogues, and that just wont do will it.

  7. #7
    Rift Chaser Foehammer25's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Synjyn View Post
    because then mages would be on par with rogues, and that just wont do will it.
    Pyros crying that their rank 3 toons can't destroy an entire raid anymore. Funny. Yup, u have to die like the rest of us now.

  8. #8
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foehammer25 View Post
    Pyros crying that their rank 3 toons can't destroy an entire raid anymore. Funny. Yup, u have to die like the rest of us now.
    ho ho gotta love the exageration that goes on in here, i guess that was along with the 20k fulminate crits as well...

  9. #9
    Rift Chaser
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    At rank4-6, pyros can absolutely destroy warfronts, as long as you have a healer or something to help keep you upright.

    Rank 3 or less, or without any decent PvE gear, yeah, you're pretty much just a free kill. Go chloro or dom/lock to be useful.

  10. #10
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverangel69 View Post
    I can just say that *my* r2 pyro with 3600ish health is a free kill in a WF. I use flicker to run and burning bonds, but people just break it, chase me, and once they catch up, it's over. I bugged Ignition because I don't think it's even working with Fireball. Imp Void Bolt is working, but Ignition isn't.
    Ignition works just fine, it's just that at rank 10 fireball has a greater cast time (2.5s) than rank 1 (2s)


    I won't go as far as saying that pyro are freekill (mind you we can take down badly geared people in matter of seconds), just that we have no toys anymore. By patchs, pyros had:
    1.0: 2 macros warriors/terrorists sabo didn't let us enough time to cast a freakin' spell so we couldn't do anything.
    1.1: Burst, escape mechanics, unreliable stuns, bunker
    1.2: Greatly reduced burst but still enough to kill things
    1.3: The fact that they exist... just exist

    So for 1.4 they'll just delete the soul since Trion can't take us anything anymore... we have nothing left.
    Last edited by Sartek; 07-01-2011 at 09:08 PM.

  11. #11
    Telaran
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    I rarely use Pyro anymore in WF's, I stick with full Dom at the moment. I can actually kill rogues now using full Dom, some times.

  12. #12
    Rift Disciple
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    Default over nerfed

    yea they ruined another class for mages. im r5 and still can kill but feels like I am playing with a lvl 1 staff lol.

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara Silverangel69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sartek View Post
    Ignition works just fine, it's just that at rank 10 fireball has a greater cast time (2.5s) than rank 1 (2s)
    Really? That's crazy... I had no idea. Thanks...

  14. #14
    Champion PandemicUK's Avatar
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    depends on the healers. but yeah in a pug its very likely would would do alot better in another spec.
    Last edited by PandemicUK; 07-03-2011 at 05:14 PM.
    RIFT Whitefall server / Pandemik / Mage (Pyromancer) Level 10-50 in warfronts. 300k favour earnt before hitting lvl 50 / Guild Black Company
    First player on Whitefall pvp server to reach 5000 pvp kills (Cutthroat). 25k+ pvp kills now pugged the whole way - single target only.

    WAR Karak Eight Peaks and Karak Norn EU servers / Pandemic / Bright Wizard / Guild Black Company
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  15. #15
    Rift Disciple
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    Basically everything you said applies to a melee rogue as well-if you just replace "pyro" with "assassin" and change some of the ability names, I can totally relate to what you are saying. If you don't like rogues play a warlock/necro-type build (there are a few different combinations that work) I have never been able to kill one with my assassin, they are very overwhelming, very good against melee types.

    On another note, I have often had pyro's hit me with a string of abilities that do 2000 or so damage each, three of those and I'm well cooked. Its hard to notice who is hitting you sometimes when you are in a melee situation with a few people around. The figures you posted don't add up with my experience, so either pyros' damage has been halved in the recent patch, or you are hitting people with rank 6 gear and or some kind of damage reduction.

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