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Thread: DoT's need some love

  1. #16
    Soulwalker
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    tool we are not talking about PvP in this thread and we are certainly not talking about LVL 27 PvP or even LVL 27 PvE

    We are talking Endgame GSB and raids.

  2. #17
    Ascendant TheLeviathan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tool View Post
    i'm only 27 now but I disagree about DoT's not being effective, at least not now.

    Warlock does not seem to me about killing people strictly with DoT's. I realize that's the flavor of the class but the DoT's are used to apply pressure and create momentum. What almost always happens in my PvP figts is that early on my DoT's don't seem to be doing much. Then There is always a 'momentum switch' in every fight where My opponent has an "oh ****" moment and at that point my DoT's move from a minor annoyance to their creeping death. This happens quickly with rogues, and slowly with healers...but it always happens (well in a winning fight heh

    PvP'ing with warlock is part art in that aspect. You need to create the pressure then manuever to create that pendulum shift that throws the fight heavily into your favor.

    Now perhaps at 51 damage tails off, I can't say (obviously). This approach works extremely well now though and I will continue along this methodology until otherwise proven its wrong.
    Pvp in the tier 2 bracket is nothing like lvl 50 pvp.
    Red ball + fulminate + really craptacular dom/pyro spec trying to hard cast transmog and pray your spell lands before some squirrel punching moron eats your controlled opp proc = +1 board warrior keeping mages from being realistically balanced in PVE or PVP. 1.0-1.2's best combo in the game. RIP FOTM Pyro rollers

  3. #18
    Rift Chaser MrGrimm999's Avatar
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    Dots need love badly, but because most necros love to go warlock, their damage would be off the charts if dots got buffed too much. These souls synergize so well, I am honestly not sure what I want. I really really want dot damage buffed, but it would suck to have necro damage nerfed. Currently, maintaining 5 dots on a target is just meh, and rather pointless in pvp unless its 1v1.

    I mean, lets look at this on a single target, these are all the things we have to maintain.

    Looming Demise
    Essence Link (in pvp only mostly)
    Life Leech
    Necrosis
    Dark Touch
    Neddra's Grasp
    Grave Rot (if mobility isn't an issue)
    Draining Bolt

    Additionally, we have to make sure we:
    Sacrifice Life->Damage
    Lich Form
    Exhume -> Empty the Crypts (additional managing somtimes neccessary depending on charge)

    While making sure our pet doesn't die.

    Don't get me wrong, all of this is doable, I consider myself a very good warlock and I usually don't have problems maintaining all of this, but it seems a little bit exessive.

    I can't speak for other callings because I mostly just play mage, but look at say SC/Ele, which has close to if not more single target dps than the necro/warlock.

    Raging Storm
    Ice Shear
    Spam Lightning Field

    Additional, make sure to:
    Static Flux (when appropriate)
    Intensify Elements
    Static Discharge

    These two specs seem to be the most single target pve dps right now, and look how much more complicated the necro/lock is...

    Well I might have digessed from my original point heh, which is yes, our warlocks dot damage does need to be increased as it requires more micromanaging to maintain.

    More skill -> more high end dps.

    I would post the rotations for aoe encounters, but both are relatively simple, with SC/ele beating out warlock/necro by a fairly large margin.
    Last edited by MrGrimm999; 04-15-2011 at 05:17 AM.

  4. #19
    Rift Chaser MrGrimm999's Avatar
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    Stupid edit rules, forgot that SC/Ele rotation needs to refresh electrify with thunderbolt when raging storm is on cd, but this fairly, easy, since this and ice shear are on the same cd, just every 15 seconds hit thunderbolt then iceshear then continue spamming LF...

  5. #20
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    Can't speak to much on the dot department, I've been playing mainly Dom/Lock/Storm, so I basically got... 4 dots? And while pve soloing, I use dots, but not as much as I would in a 'long' encounter (aka dungeon bosses/rift bosses as everything else dies to quick to make full use of it)...
    As far as there current dps (from what I've seen) its OK. Its supposed to suppliment your longer casts, so your 'constantly' doing dps, maintaining a higher 'average' dps then simply really high 'bursts' dps.

    Now, on the other hand, a slight boost wouldnt' hurt them, but to do so, you have to be careful, If they become to powerful, that'll lead to people just dotting in PvP and running away and cranking up the kills.

    So, why not add a mechanic, that makes dots start out doing small damage, but steadily increase till the end.

    Or, Add REAL synergy between dots.
    IF X is running Y does more damage. If Y is running W is doing more Damage, If W is runnning, X does more damage.
    If WXYZ are runnign, they do ALOT of damage.
    This could easilly be balanced so its only possible to get '1' top tier 'dot' and '3' smaller dots, so you can't go running around with TUVWXY&Z dots.

    That would simply mean, you can't simply 'lay' 1 dot on 1 guy and kill em, but you'd have to put several dots on him.
    And if he runs away or you run away, and he, or his healer doesn't get rid of it, its his fault.

    In PvE, it would still stay similar to how it is now, only you might use more dots in solo to assist with your bigger nukes, but it would also up your total average dot dps.


    Course, actually allowing mages to stack there dots on a target up to X stacks would be a HUGE bonus specially on raid bosses..

  6. #21
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by SinisterDeath View Post
    Or, Add REAL synergy between dots.
    IF X is running Y does more damage. If Y is running W is doing more Damage, If W is runnning, X does more damage.
    If WXYZ are runnign, they do ALOT of damage.
    This could easilly be balanced so its only possible to get '1' top tier 'dot' and '3' smaller dots, so you can't go running around with TUVWXY&Z dots.
    Now this I REALLY LIKE!

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrGrimm999 View Post
    More skill -> more high end dps.
    if this were the case warriors would do the least dps

  8. #23
    Plane Touched Bronthion's Avatar
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    Signed.

    Dots need some love.

  9. #24
    Rift Master
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    Dots are fine and already do a ton of damage.

  10. #25
    Plane Touched Bronthion's Avatar
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    We are talking here about mage dots, not cleric. Go to the cleric section with this post man.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bronthion View Post
    We are talking here about mage dots, not cleric. Go to the cleric section with this post man.
    Must be talking about when you pick up there red orb of pwnage and the dots start to tick for a clerics with out the ball.
    Quote Originally Posted by phoenixfire82 View Post
    i spam the **** out of fulminate, in fact it's the only skill i need on my bar

    <3 u fulminate

  12. #27
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    dots in pvp are somewhat of a joke

    reaver dots hit harder than mine...

    the real problem is they arent really designed for pvp, a 16s dot is just that, a ton of damage over 16s, but thats very little damage at a time, so it doesnt really kill anything. searing vitality is a 9s dot, it actually doesnt do completely horrible damage per tick because its short term. withering flames from a pyro does a HUGE amount of damage (compared to warlock dots) per tick, because its very short duration and channeled.

    on the other hand, 1 gcd that only has to be recast every 16s is good news in pve, you cast it half as often as searing vitality and can basically replace that SV cast with a 900 crit void bolt.

  13. #28
    Plane Touched Bronthion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriza View Post
    Must be talking about when you pick up there red orb of pwnage and the dots start to tick for a clerics with out the ball.

    Nah, inqi vex is hitting for 170 and my defile WITH red orb for 167 so you are wrong xD

  14. #29
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    They could just retune Neddra's influence so it dont change (or change slightly) with the kind of points an hybrid necrolock generally uses while giving a lot more hoomp going deeper into warlock.
    now: 15% fixed + 0.6% every point in 'lock, this means +33% at 30 points, +45,6% at full 51 points.
    lets change it to a 1.2% every point in 'lock (remove the fixed part), so: +36% at 30 points (really slight change), 61,2% at full 51 points.
    For a bigger effect could be 1.5% every point in 'lock: +45% at 30 points (dots would do more or less as much damage as they do now at full 51 points), a whopping +76,5% at 51 points.
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  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ruizo View Post
    They could just retune Neddra's influence so it dont change (or change slightly) with the kind of points an hybrid necrolock generally uses while giving a lot more hoomp going deeper into warlock.
    now: 15% fixed + 0.6% every point in 'lock, this means +33% at 30 points, +45,6% at full 51 points.
    lets change it to a 1.2% every point in 'lock (remove the fixed part), so: +36% at 30 points (really slight change), 61,2% at full 51 points.
    For a bigger effect could be 1.5% every point in 'lock: +45% at 30 points (dots would do more or less as much damage as they do now at full 51 points), a whopping +76,5% at 51 points.
    which would still only make the DoTs do an extra 30 damage a tick or something.

    out of curiousity, has anyone tried out the warlock greater essence from raid rifts? +111 damage per dot seems significant

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