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Thread: Why is Lifegiving Veil dispellable?

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    Rift Chaser Noobins's Avatar
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    Question Why is Lifegiving Veil dispellable?

    change it please.
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    Plane Walker Dhamp's Avatar
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    I presume "because it's a buff" won't do as an answer?

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    Telaran DollaDollaBillYall's Avatar
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    It is a buff yet a lot of callings have indispellable buffs. Thankfully, in a Warfront you have less of a chance to get it dispelled because it is likely the first buff you put on you.
    It shouldn't be able to be dispelled in my humble opinion, only because it is really one of the three things that makes a Chloromancer a healer. If you don't have all three of these things, (Bloom/Flourish, Synthesis and LGV) you aren't a healer anymore, and a lot of people forget to put it back up, I for one am guilty of forgetting about it.
    Spindrifter Pyro/Warlock/Archon on Freeholme

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhamp View Post
    I presume "because it's a buff" won't do as an answer?
    Nope. Not really. I can't think of any class where one buff is dispelled and their entire mechanic breaks down. Not a single one.

    It would be like if warriors had an ability called "Equip Weapon", and 3-4 classes had an ability called "Remove Weapon", and he had to continuously pause to put his "Equip Weapon" buff on each time he noticed he was now hitting for 50 damage instead of 500.

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    Prophet of Telara Gamma Ray's Avatar
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    Dispels actually work in a first-in/first-out basis. Found this out testing with a pyro friend in an attempt to figure out why Ground of Strength was hard to purge.

    So, Lifegiving Veil is the last thing you want to cast before going into battle.

    Nope. Not really. I can't think of any class where one buff is dispelled and their entire mechanic breaks down. Not a single one.
    Justicar? Granted, Cavalier has no CD aside from the GCD.
    Last edited by Gamma Ray; 04-07-2011 at 08:11 AM.
    "You with your fancy cooldowns and "runic" power! You know where my power comes from!? THE BACK OF MY HAND, #&!$%!"

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    Plane Walker Dhamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saboth View Post
    Nope. Not really. I can't think of any class where one buff is dispelled and their entire mechanic breaks down. Not a single one.

    It would be like if warriors had an ability called "Equip Weapon", and 3-4 classes had an ability called "Remove Weapon", and he had to continuously pause to put his "Equip Weapon" buff on each time he noticed he was now hitting for 50 damage instead of 500.
    Hate to break it to you, but that's a piss-poor analogy.

    All chloromancer spells still do *exactly* the same thing they did without LGV.

    LGV isn't active, so your healing decreases, because you can't DPS and heal at the same time.

    It's not a change in mechanic - it's a loss of a buff.

    It's the same as warlocks complaining they lose 10% damage and damage reflection when their armour is dispelled, or pyros complaining they can't proc instant Cinder Bursts.

    Whether that should be the case or not is up for question, but the fact remains it can be dispelled because it's a dispellable buff.

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    Plane Walker Dhamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gamma Ray View Post
    Dispels actually work in a first-in/first-out basis. Found this out testing with a pyro friend in an attempt to figure out why Ground of Strength was hard to purge.

    So, Lifegiving Veil is the last thing you want to cast before going into battle.



    Justicar? Granted, Cavalier has no CD aside from the GCD.
    The fact it shuts out spells makes it a mechanic change.

    Are meins dispellable?

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    Prophet of Telara Gamma Ray's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhamp View Post
    The fact it shuts out spells makes it a mechanic change.

    Are meins dispellable?
    I was wondering this myself. We might test this again this evening, when we get out of work. I have seen my Justicar buffs get stripped off, and it radically hamstrings my performance, especially when Cavalier goes down. The Meins, we'll see if we can get a word on that tonight.

    For now, it's best to wait until your buffs are almost maxed out before you LGV yourself.
    "You with your fancy cooldowns and "runic" power! You know where my power comes from!? THE BACK OF MY HAND, #&!$%!"

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    Plane Walker Squeegee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhamp View Post
    The fact it shuts out spells makes it a mechanic change.

    Are meins dispellable?
    Shuts out spells? Please tell me what you can't cast when your LGV isn't up.

    Also, it's an insta cast buff, just pay attention to what is going on.
    Shut your pie hole!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeegee View Post
    Shuts out spells? Please tell me what you can't cast when your LGV isn't up.

    Also, it's an insta cast buff, just pay attention to what is going on.
    Chloromancer = healing spec. No CC, and 90% of your heals are based off of LGV.

    You are left with your 2 long cooldown heals without it. Sure, you can waste a GCD then try and spool up a Nature's Touch against stuns/pushback and pray it's just in time to save that guy in your group but...we all know it's hard enough to get off Chloro nukes in PVP in the first place, without having to waste GCDs on getting LGV back up asap, and hoping no one dispels it again immediately.

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    Telaran Drexlorn's Avatar
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    If anyone want to do this we could put a list of undispellable buffs and see. If none falls into this it might be harder to convince dev to protect a buff helping us greatly to do our job. I can see the arguments over and over.

    Another question : are the warriors aura dispellable ? You know that -5% thing on toggle ? If it can't be dispelled, you could have LGV as a toggle acting like an "aura", problem solved.
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    Prophet of Telara Flaviusx's Avatar
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    It's a completely arbitrary design decision as to what buffs are dispellable or not, near as I can tell. So the answer to this question is: because. (It would be the same answer if it were one of the buffs that couldn't be dispelled.)

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    Plane Walker Dhamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Squeegee View Post
    Shuts out spells? Please tell me what you can't cast when your LGV isn't up.

    Also, it's an insta cast buff, just pay attention to what is going on.
    Sorry, I should have been clearer, I was referring to Cavalier, without it, you can't generate Convictions to cast Doctrines.

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    Rift Chaser Iselin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhamp View Post
    It's not a change in mechanic - it's a loss of a buff.
    You're wrong. It is a loss that is significant enough to be a change in mechanics.

    As a matter of fact, LGV shouldn't even be a buff, it should be a passive ability you get @ 10 points. Empowerd Veil, which make LGV and Entropic Veil better, is the real buff. Make that dispellable instead of passive and it would be more in line with losing the enhancements and extras others lose when debuffed.

    Losing LGV means losing the intrinsic and assumed heal-through-damage mechanic that dictates the permanent, lower base damage and coefficients that all our damage has.

    Edit: Thinking more about this... if LGV is to be a buff, then it would make sense for it to also a trigger something like a 20% base damage reduction for life spells...after first buffing all of them for +20% base, of course... It'd be nice to be able to choose between damage + heals vs. more damage.
    Last edited by Iselin; 04-07-2011 at 09:30 AM.

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    Plane Walker Dhamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iselin View Post
    Edit: Thinking more about this... if LGV is to be a buff, then it would make sense for it to also a trigger something like a 20% base damage reduction for life spells...after first buffing all of them for +20% base, of course... It'd be nice to be able to choose between damage + heals vs. more damage.
    You mean like the inability to be healed through Life-Giving Veil from another mage? i cant see why any DPS would mind about that...

    Oh wait.

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