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Thread: Mage pets tanking 5 mans/raids?

  1. #1
    Rift Chaser Elite Seraph's Avatar
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    Default Mage pets tanking 5 mans/raids?

    So I was chatting with someone in-game, and they were telling me that by stacking "of the fortress" gear and spellpower, that a Necro/Chloro or Elem/Chloro was able to tank 5 man dungeons using their pet. At first I was VERY skeptical, but the person seemed very reasonable and literate when ensuring me that they had done it.

    I don't know anything about how mage pets work. I've only played a mage for the starting zone. So my question for the mage community is(and I REALLY want people to look at this objectively, without assumptions): can mage pets really be used in the place of a regular tank?

    Please, stick to facts or things you've tanked with your pet personally, or have been there first hand to see it done. Tanking elites in the open world is one thing, but I want to know if there's any validity to the claim that mage pets can also be used to tank 5mans, or even raids.

    Thanks in advance! Trolls need not apply!

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    Rift Chaser Elite Seraph's Avatar
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    Also, if anyone has any comprehensive info on how, or IF, pets scale with gear, please include that as well.

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    Rift Disciple Ydyp's Avatar
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    Well I know for one the pets don't reach the hp of a player, also the aggro a pet generates is to low to keep it up. However this could be solved by giving the pet 3-4 minutes solo with the boss to build up enough. But even then it is still risky. The tank pets are decent, but I would prefer a player tank above any pet tank.

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    Rift Chaser Elite Seraph's Avatar
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    Right, but if pets scale with gear, how many mages actually gear themselves out to maximize the health of their pet?

    Keep in mind, I have no idea if this would work or not, that's why I'm trying to gather info. I couldn't find anything about pets scaling with the mage's gear, and that's a big factor, I think.
    Last edited by Elite Seraph; 03-18-2011 at 02:29 AM.

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    Telaran Hobboth's Avatar
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    With elem pet i can solo major rifts, but for party tanking in instances there are too low aggro generation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elite Seraph View Post
    Right, but if pets scale with gear, how many mages actually gear themselves out to maximize the health of their pet?
    I think i can have 5500-6000 hp on my greater earth elem if i spec Elem/Archon/Warlock
    Last edited by Hobboth; 03-18-2011 at 02:27 AM.

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    Rift Disciple Ydyp's Avatar
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    Well Archon buffs your pet indeed, but don't think I have seen my pets hp scale much with my endurance that I get on items. Will check it out tonight when I get home.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elite Seraph View Post
    So I was chatting with someone in-game, and they were telling me that by stacking "of the fortress" gear and spellpower, that a Necro/Chloro or Elem/Chloro was able to tank 5 man dungeons using their pet. At first I was VERY skeptical, but the person seemed very reasonable and literate when ensuring me that they had done it.
    Is there a problem here?

  8. #8
    Plane Touched Xiomaro's Avatar
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    I can totally see how this would be possible. I can often solo trash in dungeons as Necro/Lock. As Necro/Chloro I'm sure it'd be very easy.

    Survivability I'm sure would be possible, especially if you took up the tank spot as Necro/Chloro or Elem/Chloro and there was another healer as well. The real issue would be aggro control. The Necro tank pet only has one AOE aggro ability and it's on a 20s cooldown. You would have to CC or fight stuff one at a time and the DPS would still have to hold back.

    I'm sure it's possible but you probably wouldn't want to PUG it.
    Xiomaro
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    Rift Chaser Elite Seraph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerin View Post
    Is there a problem here?
    Um...no? It was an honest question. One of the primary reasons I play a cleric instead of a mage is that I want to be able to tank. Mage is very tempting, but the lack of tankability puts me off. So when someone was claiming that the pets were a viable alternative to tanking 5mans and raids, I was immediately interested.

    However, from what people are saying here, it sounds like it would be limited to rifts and not feasible for actual 5 man content or higher due to aggro control.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xiomaro View Post
    I can totally see how this would be possible. I can often solo trash in dungeons as Necro/Lock. As Necro/Chloro I'm sure it'd be very easy.

    Survivability I'm sure would be possible, especially if you took up the tank spot as Necro/Chloro or Elem/Chloro and there was another healer as well. The real issue would be aggro control. The Necro tank pet only has one AOE aggro ability and it's on a 20s cooldown. You would have to CC or fight stuff one at a time and the DPS would still have to hold back.

    I'm sure it's possible but you probably wouldn't want to PUG it.
    Yeah, its sounding more and more like something you might use as an offtank in place of CC, but not as a full fledged tank. Which is disappointing considering the versatility the soul system uses for Rift. Would be nice if mages had more than just the heal and DPS roles to fill(support if you count archon, but that class is too strange).

  10. #10
    Rift Disciple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerin View Post
    Is there a problem here?

    This guy didn't read your original post, he certainly won't be reading your replies.

  11. #11
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    afaik the pets dont really scale to gear.

    so while it is possible that they could tank some stuff, eventually they wont be able to, because their tankyness is linked to the 66 points you spend...and no matter what gear you have, 66 is the limit.

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    Rift Chaser Elite Seraph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caldern View Post
    afaik the pets dont really scale to gear.

    so while it is possible that they could tank some stuff, eventually they wont be able to, because their tankyness is linked to the 66 points you spend...and no matter what gear you have, 66 is the limit.
    Is there any literature to back this up? Like I said, I haven't been able to find anything concrete about how pets do or do not scale.

  13. #13
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Caldern View Post
    afaik the pets dont really scale to gear.

    so while it is possible that they could tank some stuff, eventually they wont be able to, because their tankyness is linked to the 66 points you spend...and no matter what gear you have, 66 is the limit.
    Pets do scale with gear. However I think its only certain stats. I thought that maybe since rogues use dex for dmg that my pet would deal more with dex gear so I tried out some dex accessories over my int ones and noticed that his dmg lowered. Didn't look at hp honestly. Ill have to check later

  14. #14
    Prophet of Telara
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    There was some fairly effective tanking with Grtr Elementals during beta - especially because of the huge pet heal Eles get when it's specced. The pets have since been nerfed though - and player power during beta was probably less than it is now too. Also, beta wasn't getting up to the really high levels.

    You can do a lot to improve the aggro control of pets, by pulling their forced retarget attacks to your own bar. The pet AI for using them is really crappy. You can also do a lot for managing aggro, by retargeting and chaning targets for auto and ability attacks from the pet. They can actually be pretty good aggro managers if you micro-manage them.

    But again... since the Ele pets were nerfed on damage in particular, it's still a tough ask for them to really main tank.

    The bigger issues lie in things like movement and positioning. Turning mobs with a pet as tank, is not an easy thing to do and certainly not a reliable maneuver. Many instances require tanks to position mobs quite precisely too - something that is very difficult to achieve with a pet... and quite often, the mage can't position themselves where they'd need to be in order to do it - due to potentially pulling other agg etc.

    I wouldn't try to main tank an instance with a pet, except with a bunch of guildie mates, to practice techniques, work tactics out and see whether we could do it well. But you can certainly use Ele pets as off-tanks quite well. Again, pull the forced retargets onto your own bar or under your own control at least... and then you can time their usage to aggro bounce with your main tank and off-tank adds etc. Having said that... in instances, most groups can usually find other tactics that are effective in these situations.

    X

  15. #15
    General of Telara
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    i think the only major problem is not about the pet going to die, especially with a chloro on him but it would be the aggro he generate in AOE or single target on boss. Some people hit for 2k. Doing a 600 lightning strike i take the aggro

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