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Thread: I can't heal well in PvP

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple Demoth's Avatar
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    Default I can't heal well in PvP

    I need help guys. I'm level 27 right now, and I'm finding it nearly impossible to heal in PvP at the moment. I was in a Codex game with a team, and I'm really starting to feel that I rolled the wrong class for healing (Maybe this will change higher up?).

    My issue was that I'm rolling as mainly a purifier with my secondary points into Sentinel with Warden as a third soul with no points.

    Anywho, I'm noticing that at my level, classes are doing insane amounts of damage to my teammates, mainly sabs and warriors. Now, I feel sabs are broken but that's a whole separate issue... the real issue is that as a cleric, I am just not able to effectively heal the massive amounts of damage that just go flying all over the place. When my group starts to take too much damage I start to lay on the Healing Communion, which basically runs me out of mana in record time.

    If I try to heal a single teammate, as is supposed to be the Purifier's "specialty", the person I'm healing usually dies. My 1.5 second heal can't heal for s**t, healing grace can maybe undo only some of the damage done (target is f'ed if being focus fired) and the 3 second Restorative Flame -always- gets interrupted... and it takes 3 seconds. 3 seconds in PvP is a heck of a lot of time. I've had warrior die while I was in the middle of pre-casting him with my 3 second heal before it could go off.

    This game is centered around group PvP, I understand that. But how can I heal in a group when all of my big heals either run me OOM in no time flat, or take 3 seconds (or more if i'm being attacked) to go off, only to be undone in half a second, even if i'm shielding people and have that perk in the Purifier tree that lets people absorb damage equal to my Spell Power.

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple
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    I'm having the same problem, but as a Warden. The damage is just too much for my HOTs to be effective and my one big "oh crap" heal - Healing Breath - is on too long of a cooldown. I don't expect to be able to heal through someone getting focused fired, but the little dinky soothing stream, healing spray and healing current just take too long with the global cooldown to be effective in PvP when that's all about burst damage and burst healing.

    So, what is the ultimate PvP healing spec (including the PvP soul if need be)?
    Last edited by Blackadar; 03-01-2011 at 06:13 AM.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    I'm not as high a level as you and I've started to feel the same way. Basically it feels like 1 healer=1 dps in power. Which on paper sounds good but in reality there are always more dps on the field than healers, so we simply cannot keep up with the damage being dished out.

    Keep in mind I do know the other end of the spectrum where one healer makes a team invincible and this isn't desirable either. Basically 1 healer should offset 1 dps, against 2 dps they should slowly lose ground, against 3 dps they lose ground steadily, and more than 3 would be no contest. So basically 2 dps could still beat down someone getting heals, but it wouldn't be insta gib thanks for playing.

    That's my feelings anyway.

  4. #4
    Shadowlander
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    That's normal, if they have 4 focus on your teammate, you just can't heal on time, at least you need 2 healer at your team to keep your teammate alive.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Demoth View Post
    I need help guys. I'm level 27 right now, and I'm finding it nearly impossible to heal in PvP at the moment. I was in a Codex game with a team, and I'm really starting to feel that I rolled the wrong class for healing (Maybe this will change higher up?).

    My issue was that I'm rolling as mainly a purifier with my secondary points into Sentinel with Warden as a third soul with no points.

    Anywho, I'm noticing that at my level, classes are doing insane amounts of damage to my teammates, mainly sabs and warriors. Now, I feel sabs are broken but that's a whole separate issue... the real issue is that as a cleric, I am just not able to effectively heal the massive amounts of damage that just go flying all over the place. When my group starts to take too much damage I start to lay on the Healing Communion, which basically runs me out of mana in record time.

    If I try to heal a single teammate, as is supposed to be the Purifier's "specialty", the person I'm healing usually dies. My 1.5 second heal can't heal for s**t, healing grace can maybe undo only some of the damage done (target is f'ed if being focus fired) and the 3 second Restorative Flame -always- gets interrupted... and it takes 3 seconds. 3 seconds in PvP is a heck of a lot of time. I've had warrior die while I was in the middle of pre-casting him with my 3 second heal before it could go off.

    This game is centered around group PvP, I understand that. But how can I heal in a group when all of my big heals either run me OOM in no time flat, or take 3 seconds (or more if i'm being attacked) to go off, only to be undone in half a second, even if i'm shielding people and have that perk in the Purifier tree that lets people absorb damage equal to my Spell Power.
    I find the same issue also with mostly purifier spec and it got worse as I got to lvl 36 in Beta. There are many threads on this which lean towards Bard as a better warfront healer (group heals with no range limit ), but it bothers me that the "purest" healing class sucks in pvp healing (by sucks I mean can't heal a player faster then DPS is hitting). Maybe im incorrectly specced/not good enough or classes still need balancing, but I was a pretty good BG healer with a disc priest in WOW (sorry for the comparison).

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple Demoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackadar View Post
    I'm having the same problem, but as a Warden. The damage is just too much for my HOTs to be effective and my one big "oh crap" heal - Healing Breath - is on too long of a cooldown. I don't expect to be able to heal through someone getting focused fired, but the little dinky soothing stream, healing spray and healing current just take too long with the global cooldown to be effective in PvP when that's all about burst damage and burst healing.

    So, what is the ultimate PvP healing spec (including the PvP soul if need be)?
    Yeah. I mean, I don't expect to be able to heal someone if the entire raid is focused on them, but the opposing team last night had a Bard and a Chloro that were topping the charts in healing done. I have absolutely NO idea what buffs / spells were being used, but this one warrior had some HoTs on him that literally undid even my fully charged Obliterate (after I switched to DPS spec) in just one tick... and he had no Line of Sight to his teammates, so it was definitely a HoT or two.

    I've switched things around a bit to put Warden as my main (last night) in a 3rd role for just experimenting, and NONE of my HoTs were healing for that much. None. So I'm really at a loss for how he was able to basically shrug off so many attacks, because I need to learn that spell.

  7. #7
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellestil View Post
    I'm not as high a level as you and I've started to feel the same way. Basically it feels like 1 healer=1 dps in power. Which on paper sounds good but in reality there are always more dps on the field than healers, so we simply cannot keep up with the damage being dished out.

    Keep in mind I do know the other end of the spectrum where one healer makes a team invincible and this isn't desirable either. Basically 1 healer should offset 1 dps, against 2 dps they should slowly lose ground, against 3 dps they lose ground steadily, and more than 3 would be no contest. So basically 2 dps could still beat down someone getting heals, but it wouldn't be insta gib thanks for playing.

    That's my feelings anyway.
    I do agree with you.

  8. #8
    Rift Disciple
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    Decide if you want to AOE heal or focus heal. You will fail if you try to do both at same time. You will oom, people will die, you will die and you will be confused. Spec and prepare and learn to play one role.
    Clerics excell at both, other clases excell at aoe heals aswell. Thats why i tend to chose focus heal and dispel.

    If you AOE heal try primary as warden or justicar
    If you focus heal try primary as sentinel or puri

    If you get focused alot cause you have tendency to rush forward mix senti or puri or warden with justicar.
    Dont try to DPS and heal untill you can heal as a lion. Focus on one.

    Before fights start dont panic. When someone rushes you learn to use shield and detaunt and dont panic.

    Look infront of you and see wich guy is opening himself to damage. This is most important.Precast a heal. Usually you can see a warrior geting ready to rush in.
    Spam dispels. Alot. Then spam them some more. Use shields alot ( damage soaks help in focus healing imensly, be it shields of purifier or damage reduction buff of sentinel ).

    Make macros. Instant cass + large heal. Justicars friendly buff + heal for targeted heal etc..

    Thats what i do at the moment. Game is just out. Everyone sucks.

    Stats in end mean nothing. 30K healing can save lives while 60K healing just keeps people toped. Dont mind the numbers.
    For the most awesome game understanding and balancing ideea :
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyborg View Post
    ... look and tuned down at the so powerful self heals and damage output that some clerics can do ,maybe add 3-4 sec cd for the big heals ( more than 400 heal ) it can be a good idea ...

  9. #9
    Shadowlander janarick's Avatar
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    Good point about it is that healers are not as OP in warfronts as they are in some other games.

    I so play also cleric as my main. My heal can assist groupmembers a bit, but really do not make any big difference or cannot save anyone that gets focused by several people.

  10. #10
    Rift Disciple Demoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burny View Post
    I find the same issue also with mostly purifier spec and it got worse as I got to lvl 36 in Beta. There are many threads on this which lean towards Bard as a better warfront healer (group heals with no range limit ), but it bothers me that the "purest" healing class sucks in pvp healing (by sucks I mean can't heal a player faster then DPS is hitting). Maybe im incorrectly specced/not good enough or classes still need balancing, but I was a pretty good BG healer with a disc priest in WOW (sorry for the comparison).
    The reason I posted this was because I was curious as to whether it was just me that was failing or if the cleric needed some love... or maybe I'm just not seeing something because I'm not level 50 yet.

    But I'm also seeing a lot of people complaining about clerics into the 30's as well, which seems to say that the scaling issue is getting worse; that's probably just jumping to conclusions, but I would be really sad to learn that I leveled all the way to 50, only to learn that I picked a class that's only good for PVE.

  11. #11
    Rift Disciple
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    please also keep in mind the levels

    trying to heal a lvl 21 mage beeing nuked by 3 lvl 29 mages is not going to happen
    For the most awesome game understanding and balancing ideea :
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyborg View Post
    ... look and tuned down at the so powerful self heals and damage output that some clerics can do ,maybe add 3-4 sec cd for the big heals ( more than 400 heal ) it can be a good idea ...

  12. #12
    Soulwalker
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    i have been having this issue as well and had arguments with my friends about my inabilities to heal.

    i started to notice the problem around 25 but wasn't an issue till the 30 bracket. i played Sentinel/purifier/temp for break free, the problem is simple their burst is greater then my players hp and come faster then my heals can go unless i preset a grp heal. i only have this issue when zerging codex or playing black garden which means 2-3 people assisting one target = instant dead, i don't think the issue lays within the numbers sabs and other classes can push out, i think the issue is how durable our players are.

    i have had good results when running with a bard or chloro i assume they are either just way better healers our their non stop hot effect they both have gives me enough time to burst heal my targets if they were not one shotted. i also had much better luck with just dispelling instead of healing keeping dots and other effects off the players seems to be much, much more rewarding then actually healing them. i was planing to try out a warden spec only because the hot effects would be the same as chloro and bard while having some cooldown burst heals to fill in my own gap, i haven't tried it yet but i heard warden is mana intensive.

    our low durability as a whole (not referring to just cleric) will prolly change in the higher levels and when gear is added into the picture. assuming our army can live through the burst clerics are stronger healers then the DPSers that can heal.

  13. #13
    Telaran xboomx's Avatar
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    this is what i am trying to build up to, some minor revisions from the cleric guide http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00Gje.ExoEc0doz..xx0b

    i like to cast healing flood (aoe dots) with tidal surge and flashover to get more bangfromthebuck. or at least cast HF with either one.

    i use healing breath when it is up and healing flame (1.5sec) for my "big" heal.

    cauterize when able. searing transfusion when able.

    i started doing better in codez/bg with this spec. sentinel main was too mana dependent due to healing communion and too slow of an aoe heal for me.

  14. #14
    Soulwalker
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    You can dispell Sab charges just as fast as they can throw them. Funny thing is, they start to run out of energy and throw slower while you still have plenty of mana, so pop some heals then. Also, damage reduction is sometimes better than healing. Spec as many shields as you can and make sure to use them. However, I think the reason it is hard to heal is because the UI is complete **** for healing at the moment.

  15. #15
    Rift Disciple Demoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dis Aster View Post
    Decide if you want to AOE heal or focus heal. You will fail if you try to do both at same time. You will oom, people will die, you will die and you will be confused. Spec and prepare and learn to play one role.
    Clerics excell at both, other clases excell at aoe heals aswell. Thats why i tend to chose focus heal and dispel.
    My main issue is that I am specced mainly for just single target heals, while I made a second role for group heals, and a third role where Warden was my main to test the HoTs.

    Again, specced purely as my Purifier, I cannot heal faster than people can dish out damage. I don't panic when I get attacked, I just get outright killed before I can tell what's happening. Once a sab gets on me it's pretty much game over because now i'm spamming dispells on myself, effectively taking me out of the game, and what's worse is that a sab was able to put charges on me last night faster than I was able to cleanse them. I would get 1 charge on me, cleanse, and then I'd have 2... cleanse, then 3... yeah, it took him a lot longer to do it, but he still managed to get all 5 and crit detonate me for 4/5'th my health. Then some warrior came flying out of no-where and sliced me in two.

    But your point on macros is well noted. I don't usually like macros because I find I'm quicker to react to a situation when I can manually hit the buttons I want. Right now I'm able to use 18 abilities because every key on my keyboard that isn't "E, S, D, F"(my movement keys) is bound to use an ability, and it's almost become instinct on which key does what for which role (and I have no idea how I can remember so many button combos).

    Again though, PvP in this game is just really chaotic right now. People do insane burst damage, and my burst healing just does not seem to keep pace.

    I don't want to be an OP power house of healing that can keep the entire raid alive through 500 people on them. In Black Garden I'm able to generally keep the Fang Carrier (or myself if I have it) alive, but it's absolutely asinine that 1 sab, as an example, and any other class can out DPS 1 person faster than 2 clerics can heal that person.

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