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Thread: Clerics need to be worked on

  1. #16
    Shadowlander Dragynkyn's Avatar
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    Cleric dps just needs to be tweeked honestly and its more crit power dependent than most, especially in shaman which has a really high crit rate, so if your fragments arent the best you suffer more than most. That being said know your roles. Inq is highest dps if you dont have target swapping right now. Shaman if you do or have a ton of movement. Yes clerics are about 10% off in raids and 20 from rogues. I parsed a bit higher on pts with up coming changes, though not a ton. I think alot of it is fragments. And if you are only playing shaman you may want to try inq. My inq dummy parse is currently higher than my shaman.
    Last edited by Dragynkyn; 07-11-2017 at 08:16 AM.

  2. #17
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    Maybe the answer to the eternal weapon buff is for it to trigger at >75% mana and then last for 5-10s (would need parsing tyo work out a sensible figure). This would give a bit more leaway to recharge mana as needed and mean when we open up our buff isn't loss while we are still debuffing. This would give better uptime. (if needed for balance scale back the size of the buff)
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  3. #18
    Rift Disciple Gharn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thunrar View Post
    Maybe the answer to the eternal weapon buff is for it to trigger at >75% mana and then last for 5-10s (would need parsing tyo work out a sensible figure). This would give a bit more leaway to recharge mana as needed and mean when we open up our buff isn't loss while we are still debuffing. This would give better uptime. (if needed for balance scale back the size of the buff)
    Personally the buff is a mess. It allows for some extra damage on bursts in the start, but after that it's pointless. Even with your idea, the problem pops up when you're healing or using mana hungry roles. Anything intense will easily spend your mana and you will rarely have the buff active. Only Warden (haven't messed much with Sentinel yet) have a good mana regain that doesn't screw up your healing. Puri is stuck with the "sacrifice" spell and you're completely locked out of doing any healing while doing so, since it's not OGCD.

    The buff either have to be changed to be much stronger, so it allows a rotation to be "broken" because we have to use mana regain abilities, or it should be weaker and semi permanent like a pulse all the way down to 25%.
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  4. #19
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    This is one of those times where you need a dev or a CM to just say "we're looking into it, we know it's not perfect", it hurts me to just have to say that, but they still don't get it unfortunately.

    For now, you've just got to assume nothing is getting fixed or changed until it randomly appears on PTS. Doesn't take a genius to realise this assumption is the last thing you want to portray, but that seems like the direction they want to take.
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  5. #20
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    It's not just healers and dps clerics that this is affecting, its affecting tanking as well, most of the time. When tanking multiple targets I can block, its not a problem thanks to the Commitment passive...though when tanking a single target, esp something like a raid boss, it becomes quite apparent. Maybe its just me, but since it was actually upgraded into eternal quality, it seems like I'm blowing through mana even faster when tanking. Yeah, Purpose restores 10% mana per melee hit, and that sounds good, until you take a moment to think about those abilities are costing mana to use, to get that 10% back. And once you're above 75% again, you're back to dealing with double mana costs again, while trying to restore mana. HoF doesn't proc Purpose to restore mana, and to the best of my knowledge neither do Precept of Refuge or DoA.

    I'm not sure what the solution is, but there has to be one beyond what's currently in place that maintains balance as well.

  6. #21
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    first post here just to agree with some of these recent posts,

    giving inscribe fate the same buff and duration as the new fervent fate would go a long way in fixing our backloaded dps issues and target switching, it's incredibly restricting with it's 8 second CD and 20 second uptime, if we can only use it as paid off-soul it should be better.

    As people say our peak dps is now comparable to mages and warriors (rogues and primalists still 100k in front) but the bolt of light and inscribe fate changes to fervent strike buff could improve cleric frustrations without adding anything too unknown to the balance, it would just mean our peak dps can be maintained more often then just perfect situations.

    The eternal definitely needs looking at too, the next upgrade stage i'd imagine will leave us behind other classes, and why is it built to be of zero use to wardens and defilers who rely on DOTS/HOTS, or is there a reason those specs now need to be killed?
    Last edited by Tekien; 08-05-2017 at 03:03 AM.

  7. #22
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    • Whats your CP? Are you at or near the soft cap (8500+ CP)
    • Whats your average fragment infusion level? Do you have all lvl 15 bis or close to bis fragments?
    • Have you been practising the optimal rotation for your class?
    • Do you have your eternal?
    • Do you use consumables?
    • DO you have upgraded raid gear from nm td or irotp?

    All I see in these cleric and mage threads are average players pointing at better geared and prepared players and whining about class imbalance.

    The players doing top dps are doing so for a reason - they tick all the above boxes and then some

    One does not simply roll a rogue or primalist and magically become "top" dps.

    Just because you have ****ty gear, dont upgrade your weapon, dont upgrade your fragments, dont use consumables - does not entitle you to cry foul.

    I've seen well played clerics top the dps; for every rogue at the top of the meter there are 5 mediocre rogues at the bottom, and the only reason you see more primalists at the top is because primalists, having spent extra $ to get the class and souls are more likely to invest more in improving their character.

    For what its worth, the top dps in game right now is Mage. Single Target.
    I'm not going to be telling you what spec, figure it out yourselves.

    TLDR: Get good, whining on the forums wont fix mediocrity.
    Last edited by Crewcut; 08-05-2017 at 06:24 AM.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crewcut View Post
    For what its worth, the top dps in game right now is Mage. Single Target.
    I'm not going to be telling you what spec, figure it out yourselves.
    Link 2+min parse with sustained 2.3m+ dps; idc if you hide the abilities still; just prove it.
    Last edited by Xethx; 08-05-2017 at 06:46 AM.

  9. #24
    Rift Disciple Kreezhem's Avatar
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    Top dps is prima by far for now.

    On pure single target with high cp I'd say rogue and cleric are equivalent, then war and mage a bit behind.

    The issue is the lack of cleave of cleric. If you cleave your st dps drops by a lot. Also the eternal weapon system is bad. Maybe a timed damage boost would be better and include some mana regent in your rotation.

    Exemple : when you get under 25% mana you gain a 15secs buff and when you get above 75% mana you gain a 15secs buff again. You can't have twice the same buff.

    It could make cleric really challenging and interesting to play. But the buff needs to be important to make it worth it.

  10. #25
    Ascendant Zehne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crewcut View Post
    All I see in these cleric and mage threads are average players pointing at better geared and prepared players and whining about class imbalance.
    The problem with this, at least up until 4.2 is that cleric is HEAVILY HEAVILY reliant on CP for dps.

    And until 4.2 coming anywhere near the CP needed was pure P2W.

    Now CP is somewhat farmable but fragments still have a huge contribution.

    Full BiS essences will run you ~~3500(556x4 + 638*2) CP, you can get another 380 on seal rune.

    That means that there is ~~4500 CP from fragments you 'Need' to make clerics perform on the high end. That's 4500 CP of P2W still. It's less than before but it's still alot.

    The problem isn't people complaining about gearing up the problem is that the most critical gear is locked behind RNG and a plat sink.
    Last edited by Zehne; 08-05-2017 at 08:21 PM.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zehne View Post
    That means that there is ~~4500 CP from fragments you 'Need' to make clerics perform on the high end. That's 4500 CP of P2W still. It's less than before but it's still alot.

    The problem isn't people complaining about gearing up the problem is that the most critical gear is locked behind RNG and a plat sink.
    And how is this a Cleric problem? It applies equally to all.

    Everyone benefits from more CP, and those who get the better gear (frags. cp what have you) does more dps.

    Are Clerics suggesting they should have their abilities tuned for more damage because they are finding it hard to get CP fragments?
    Last edited by Crewcut; 08-05-2017 at 08:56 PM.

  12. #27
    Fia
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crewcut View Post
    One does not simply roll a rogue or primalist and magically become "top" dps.
    Actually yes, right now they kind of do, which is also the reason why ppl are complaining, though it seems to have gotten better now.
    Last edited by Fia; 08-05-2017 at 09:09 PM.
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  13. #28
    Ascendant Zehne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crewcut View Post
    And how is this a Cleric problem? It applies equally to all.
    WRONG

    Cleric dps specs have always been heavily centric around force crits and higher crit rates. CP is usually much more important for clerics than it is for most other classes.

    Inquis: ~~100% crit rate during c/d's, +10% passive crit from buffs, +10% crit to dots

    Sham: 100% crit on massive blow, 10 stacks for 'force crit' every 1 min which align's with +75% damage every 1 min, +5% passive crit chance, +10% crit chance to air and water abilities (the majority of sham damage)

    RS: Force crit on smiting which is the lions share of dps, +10% chance to spam ability.

    Add in the fact that clerics have some of the biggest mainstat bonus talents in game, our SC (especially in this expansion with gearing system) tends to be higher than most classes.
    Last edited by Zehne; 08-05-2017 at 09:33 PM.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zehne View Post
    WRONG

    Cleric dps specs have always been heavily centric around force crits and higher crit rates. CP is usually much more important for clerics than it is for most other classes.

    Inquis: ~~100% crit rate during c/d's, +10% passive crit from buffs, +10% crit to dots

    Sham: 100% crit on massive blow, 10 stacks for 'force crit' every 1 min which align's with +75% damage every 1 min, +5% passive crit chance, +10% crit chance to air and water abilities (the majority of sham damage)

    RS: Force crit on smiting which is the lions share of dps, +10% chance to spam ability.

    Add in the fact that clerics have some of the biggest mainstat bonus talents in game, our SC (especially in this expansion with gearing system) tends to be higher than most classes.
    All you're saying is Clerics have more crit chance.

    Getting better gear, getting more CP for more dps applies to all.

    Seems like the only thing that needs to be worked on is Clerics going out there and getting the appropriate gear/CP. Thats on you.
    Last edited by Crewcut; 08-06-2017 at 02:02 AM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fia View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Crewcut
    One does not simply roll a rogue or primalist and magically become "top" dps.
    Actually yes, right now they kind of do, which is also the reason why ppl are complaining, though it seems to have gotten better now.
    If thats what you believe - feel free to roll a rogue or primalist alt, and let us know when you "top" the meters.
    Last edited by Crewcut; 08-06-2017 at 02:07 AM.

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