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Thread: Shaman/Justicar/Warden.

  1. #1
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    Default Shaman/Justicar/Warden.

    Hey all, just wanted to run this build by the general public to see what you think of it, any suggestions are welcome!

    I was messing around with this build in the beta while I was trying to create a good soloing character. I've put 11 points into Justicar, 11 into Warden and 44 points into Shaman.

    Heres the build:

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00...VqeusGsIk.xuzo

    Heres a break down of their viability for different roles:

    Dealing dmage (Melee):
    Shaman is the base soul, as they are the primary melee clerics. Shamans are a good class with good self buffs, which become group buffs with Shared Purpose talent. In addition, they can switch between heavy single target damage and AoE abilities fairly easily by swapping Vengeances. Their numerous Heart Spells provide great magical defenses. Battle Charge is an excellent talent, a 15 second gap closer that clears all snares and stuns, as well as snaring the target by 70% for 6 seconds, almost half of the downtime. Their passive, non-buff abilities are largely crit based, which synergizes well with the +crit damage talents available in the Shaman tree.

    Dealing damage: (ranged)
    This Cleric spec will deal very little ranged damage, if any. Some Warden and Justicar that we pick up in the root skills are ranged, but really they should only be used when trying to close a gap and Battle Charge is on CD.

    Tanking:
    This spec has little to no tanking capability. Their self healing will let them stay alive for a little while, but with sparse damage reduction abilities the Shaman will need a good healer or two to keep them alive against multiple, tough elites.

    Self-Healing:
    Since Shamans they don't have many survivability skills, I've chosen Justicar and Warden to offset that. In the Justicar Tree, we 3/3 Life's devotion, Salvation will always heal on hit, and Justicar attack abilities heal for a amazing 25% of damage done, and non-Justicar abilities for respectable 11% of damage done. In addition, 3/3 endless winter and 5/5 Unstoppable force will make me regen and additional 5% maximum health and man a on a critical hit. Because of this, I've given crit talents higher priority than +dmg. In addition, since this spec shies away from ranged attacks, we can dump all of our convictions into Doctrine of Bliss to burst heal when taking heavy damage.

    In the Warden tree, as well as having access to a nice knock back, (Crushing Wave), we have more utility in our healing than the Justicar Tree. Cleansing Waters gives the spec a sorely needed disease/poison/curse cleanse. We also gain access to couple of nice, instant HoT's. Tack these onto our already robust self-healing, and we have a good bit of survivability to go with out Shaman damage. Dehydrate is a nice, ranged DoT to keep the pressure on ranged enemies, and Dissolution, combined with Battle Charge will the Cleric us extremely mobile. Since we don't use spells with a cast time, Destructive Tide and Surging Rapids are excellent passive buffs to out instant heals and spells. Tidal Surge combined with Healing Current or Doctrine of Bliss (Justicar tree) gives us an OK burst healing capability.

    Group Utility and Synerigaztion:
    This spec doesn't really have a offensive group buff outside of Shared Purpose with a Courage buff. However, instant HoT's from the Warden tree can take some strain off of healers. Reparation, a Justicar talent, is where our group utility really shines however. With out constant, heavy damage and Reparation, we can provide a steady stream of healing to an entire party, or up to 10 raid members. Reparation causes out cleric abilities to heal 25% of the damage done to up to 10 people, while non-cleric abilities will refund 10% damage done as health. Reparation, combined with the Shamans high damage and AoE capability should theoretically heal a good amount to an entire party, giving the healer some breathing room. Reparation is essentially a constant, group wide HoT. This class also has essentially no CC.

    Gear:
    The Courage Buffs from the Shaman tree are absolutely ESSENTIAL TO KEEP UP AT ALL TIMES! These hour long buffs, along with a nice stat boost, converts our Spell Power to Attack Power, Spell Crit to Physical Crit, and Spell Focus to hit rating. Since we gain melee stats from caster stats, spell-caster gear will generally be better than physical gear. Since we can have high attack power and spell power at the same time, we really have the best of both world. While our main damage source is still physical, we can throw in some instant spells against heavily armored enemies, bypassing defenses with a bolt of light or a jet of water.

    Summary:
    This build focuses mainly on Soloing and PvP ability. The main focus stat-wise would be Hit and Crit. Since our self-healing is largely reliant on attacking the enemy, this cleric needs to be able to reliably hit it's target. Even though most of our spells and abilities have a low mana cost, Manga regen is a major weakness in this build. Endless Winter causes crits to return mana to the Cleric, thus crit is very important.

    As previously stated, much of our self healing and mana regen comes from hitting enemies. As thus, our run away ability is almost nil. If you get into a scarp with this spec, you better be able to finish it. Rage of the North, the top tier shaman talent causes all our hits to critically hit for 9 seconds, on a 2 min CD. Since crits heal for even more than regular attacks, RoTN will provide a great burst heal, this is when you should dish our your heavy hitting cooldowns.

    When in a group, the Cleric provides a steady, respectable HoT to the group with reparation (as long as you are hitting something!) , as well as strong elemental and some targeted, instant cast direct heals and HoTs.

    Although our damage at range lacks compared to close range, we have high spellpower thanks to our caster gear giving melee stats from our courage buff, so we can keep a couple of dots on ranged classes to keep up the pressure. In addition, Battle Charge is an excellent gap closer, CC break and 70% snare that is on a short, 15 second CD. The Dissolution talent picked up from the Warden tree is a 8 second snare / root abilities.
    __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _________________

    Andddd thats it. After you all are done reading, please provide any suggestions or changes you would make to this build! Since the current level cap in the Beta is 30, most of my analysis is hypothetical, I won't be able to field-test the build till the game is released.

    Again, if I've described an ability wrong, or you see a glaring oversight that you can rectify, or just plain think this build sucks, please say so.

    Thanks everyone for taking the time to read this!

    Edit: Found a better calculator.
    Last edited by Sielys; 02-01-2011 at 09:38 AM.
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  2. #2
    Soulwalker
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    The build is wrong....in order to get dissolution in Warden tree you have to spend 10 points in warden tree you have only 9

    Never mind i see its fixed
    Last edited by scr44py; 02-01-2011 at 11:03 AM.

  3. #3
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scr44py View Post
    The build is wrong....in order to get dissolution in Warden tree you have to spend 10 points in warden tree you have only 9
    Your right, I'm having trouble with these calcs...
    Try:
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10...VqeusGsIk.xuzo

    As stated in the OP, I spend 44 points in Shaman, 11 in Justicar, and 11 in Warden.

    Edit: Oh wait, the calc in my OP seems to display the right build...are you sure you didn't mess with the URL on accident somehow?
    Last edited by Sielys; 02-01-2011 at 10:59 AM.
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  4. #4
    Telaran Emezim's Avatar
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    I dislike your build. You will get owned in PVP.
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  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sielys View Post
    Your right, I'm having trouble with these calcs...
    Try:
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=10...VqeusGsIk.xuzo

    As stated in the OP, I spend 44 points in Shaman, 11 in Justicar, and 11 in Warden.

    Edit: Oh wait, the calc in my OP seems to display the right build...are you sure you didn't mess with the URL on accident somehow?

    no no i saw the post before u edited it and there was this build http://www.riftrolebuilder.com/build...ar.10013100500 and in this one you had only 10 points in warden tree

  6. #6
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by scr44py View Post
    no no i saw the post before u edited it and there was this build http://www.riftrolebuilder.com/build...ar.10013100500 and in this one you had only 10 points in warden tree
    Oh alright. So whats your thoughts then?


    Quote Originally Posted by Emezim View Post
    I dislike your build. You will get owned in PVP.
    I mainly created this for PvE so what are your thoughts in that area?
    And also why do you think I'd get owned in PvP? I didn't really get to try much PvP before the Beta ended. I'm guessing the primary reason may be that I have no way to break CC like fear or confuse?

    So yea, for future posters: Please explain why you think it's bad or good, instead of just stating one or the other.

    Thanks again all.
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  7. #7
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sielys View Post
    Oh alright. So whats your thoughts then?




    I mainly created this for PvE so what are your thoughts in that area?
    And also why do you think I'd get owned in PvP? I didn't really get to try much PvP before the Beta ended. I'm guessing the primary reason may be that I have no way to break CC like fear or confuse?

    So yea, for future posters: Please explain why you think it's bad or good, instead of just stating one or the other.

    Thanks again all.
    some good things: you went 44 pts into shaman which will solidify you as a decent melee dps with amazing courage buff. tbh im not quite sure justicar creates more synergy with shaman over druid.

    with druid u are guaranteed a 5% increase in attack power, a 5% crit increase ( shamans will love crit) and an on demand burst ability ( eruption of life) ehh

    im glad rift is what it is b/c the combos are infinite but i am almost persuaded by looking at each tree from a melee perspective. that shaman and druid will be your 2 main melee "dps" one being inherently bursty---then sustained (shaman) and the other inherently sustained (due to pet) then having an "burst " move witt eruption of life.

    i think your spot on with warden tho it helps in pve a lot.. a spammable nuke that can help in rifts when your running to a target and a HoT i personally think you may be misguided ( not you per se) but people thinking justicar will add more "umph:" to thier dps when justicar is split between a healer one side and a tank the other.

    sure if u want to play the whole " im a dps and will surivive" then sure justicar will help achieve it but any cleric that adds some points into druid will prolly out dps you and in pvp he will have an isntant heal/ 2shields a hot and spammable range attack as well as a cleanse of poison/diseases and curses.

    somthn to keep in ya toolbox mind the shamans talents will change but below this is what i would do

    for pvp (my melee spec b/c i will heal) ill be doing this route
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00...0s.AqeusMsIk.M

    for pve:
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00...oh0b.yqxusrsIk

  8. #8
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    Druid...mehhhhh. I dislike pet classes :

    I'll give it a shot though. Looking at the souls, it seems like druid self healing is more 'bursty', whilst Justicar provides an average, steady flow of health through attacks. Since I can't test how much Unstoppable Force will be able to heal at the moment, I assumed that Salvation would be a good way to flesh out the dmg per strike abilities shamans already have. Reparation also looks almost too good to pass up.

    The overall purpose of this build was to provide a good solo PvE experience, as well as having stronger group utility at the sacrifice of a little damage. I don't mind being second or third in the charts if we have a nice, smooth run. You dps is 0 if you're dead, after all.

    (Also, I thought this build looked ok from a pvp standpoint, but as I said I haven't had much practical Rift PvP experience)
    Last edited by Sielys; 02-01-2011 at 03:39 PM.
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  9. #9
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sielys View Post
    Druid...mehhhhh. I dislike pet classes :

    I'll give it a shot though. Looking at the souls, it seems like druid self healing is more 'bursty', whilst Justicar provides an average, steady flow of health through attacks. Since I can't test how much Unstoppable Force will be able to heal at the moment, I assumed that Salvation would be a good way to flesh out the dmg per strike abilities shamans already have. Reparation also looks almost too good to pass up.

    The overall purpose of this build was to provide a good solo PvE experience, as well as having stronger group utility at the sacrifice of a little damage. I don't mind being second or third in the charts if we have a nice, smooth run. You dps is 0 if you're dead, after all.

    (Also, I thought this build looked ok from a pvp standpoint, but as I said I haven't had much practical Rift PvP experience)

    i feel you on pets.. i dont like it so if mine dies ehh who cares for pve justicar just might be better than warden, but not druid if looking at damage potential.. the druid links up well by adding the aforementioned buffs.

    but to each his own man im sure what works for you wont work for me.

  10. #10
    Telaran
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    Does Favored of the Valnir affect self-heals and proc'd heals?

  11. #11
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nokkers View Post
    Does Favored of the Valnir affect self-heals and proc'd heals?
    I wondered that as well, the wording of the talent was very vague, but I'm assuming it includes all heals upon yourself.

    The druid pets don't seem too amazing as it is... I know Trion wanted the Druid class to be pretty reliant on their pets, but the pets in the current druid build are a bit lackluster. They'll probably change the effectiveness druid pets by launch, but all in all, it's really hard to predict how viable builds created now will be when live hits. I'm mostly testing stuff out because I love
    theory-crafting >.>
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  12. #12
    Shadowlander Sielys's Avatar
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    And abump! Don't die on me yet little thread!
    I'm still curious as to what you all think of this build. Is it just that boring that you don't comment on it?

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  13. #13
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emezim View Post
    I dislike your build. You will get owned in PVP.
    And you know this how? Cause you have played for like 10 days up to level 30 maybe. Maybe a more constructive comment was warranted.

  14. #14
    Telaran
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    I'm toying with different ideas my self. I'm looking at Justicar/Sham/Druid (5/35/26) or ward/sham/druid (11/34/21) right now. I dont really think there is a wrong answer i really think its if u wanna try and be pure dps and limited support or if you are like m and dig being able to do decent DPS and decent support. I lke being able to save the grp from a wipe. But I guess this is also the draw to Rift its how you wanna play not how TRION is forcing you to play.

  15. #15
    Rift Chaser
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    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00....EVxh0rc0k.xuz

    came up with this last night, the idea was to heal myself thru dmg and having the option to get some nifty silence/hots/shields. But perhaps I should pick a different soul for warden as I was looking for something that has big instant heals with the possibilty to heal myself with a cast time.

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