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Thread: Spell Crit Vs Crit Power

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    Default Spell Crit Vs Crit Power

    As a cleric i have read and been told that gear should be focused around crit power. what i dont understand is why? surely spell crit is worth more and should be focused, since crit power adds to spell crit? my current spell crit is 18.58% and my crit power is 37.90%. so its quite low for "crits" to go off.

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    Your dps specs will have extreme passive crit chance buffs that will not show up on your spell crit %.

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    What above poster said.

    Also keep in mind not only class passives, active, or proc abilities that increase crit, but also raid buffs and debuffs as well...example assassin debuff + enrage from BM...amazing! Use your own crit passives plus the raid buffs that boost your main stat and raid consumables that increase your main stat (main stat increases crit chance as well) and a crit pot....holy cow. Moo.

    Basically people stack crit power till the raid buffs will put them at cap, because there are numerous other sources that raise your crit well beyond what you see in your resting stat screen.

    Once that is at max, the next most important stat is attack power or spell power, because thats the only other way to raise your critical hit damage. If for some reason you could get enough spell power or attack power (which I dont think most will, if any) then you can revert to the old formulas that balanced crit chance with power stat at a given ratio like it was before crit power ever came out.

    To explain that balance you actually have to use calculus based statistics because it requires statistics on lots of data and comparisons of rate changes. Which there is an actual forum post available for those mathematically inclined to do so but I think its in the archives. Anywho that was already looked at and the math turns out to the following summary:

    1) Hit crit power cap while considering raid buffs or proc buffs
    2) Then focus on spell power or attack power. This may ultimately mean changing some crit power pieces to spell power as other crit power pieces gain even more crit power putting you over an effective cap.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenoheart View Post
    2) Then focus on spell power or attack power. This may ultimately mean changing some crit power pieces to spell power as other crit power pieces gain even more crit power putting you over an effective cap.
    This is all build specific when at max cp. For shaman, crit chance's weight is heavily diminished due to rage of the north. For other souls without multiple force crits some critical hit pieces overtake sp counterparts simply due to how much crit chance is found on those items compared to an so piece of equal tier.
    Last edited by haybale; 08-08-2014 at 09:18 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by haybale View Post
    This is all build specific when at max cp. For shaman, crit chance's weight is heavily diminished due to rage of the north. For other souls without multiple force crits some critical hit pieces overtake sp counterparts simply due to how much crit chance is found on those items compared to an so piece of equal tier.
    I have been mulling this over in my head, and I am feeling similar thoughts but are you able to tell us what spell crit soft and/or hard cap actually is?

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    This is not a black and white topic.

    The truth is, CP for a cleric is alot less powerful than CP for say, a warrior.

    SP has alot higher pull for clerics than AP/SP does for other classes aswell.

    Also, the spec has alot to do with which stat has a higher effect on your dps.

    But essentially, don't tank your SP in order to gain a few CP.

    Don't Blindly stack CP aswell, all too often i'll hear someone say that they have reached the CP cap. This is bad, extremely bad. Especially since all it means is that they are wasting good buffs, and could of had a few hundred SP/AP and the same CP.

    Don't let SC be a 100% turn off.

    I recently upgraded my gloves, I lost 52 sp, but gained roughly 25wis/int, and 150SC.
    Because of the wisdom/intellect, I realistically lost only about 25 sp, but actually gained 175 SC. The sheer amount of SC rating made it a worthwhile trade.

    Too sum it all up: There is no one stat you can go for that will magically make you better. In everything there needs to be a balance. Generally speaking though, if you upgrade a piece of gear from one tier to a higher one, you won't ever go wrong. If you want to keep things simple, find the optimal amount of CP that won't hit the cap inside of a raid. Get close to it, but don't go over, and from there on out, stack SP.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zehne View Post
    The truth is, CP for a cleric is alot less powerful than CP for say, a warrior.
    What ? Shaman and Inquisitor are part of the specs with the highest need for CP in the game, considering how their crit chance is high and how it is forced around their burst.
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    Quote Originally Posted by scott0301 View Post
    I have been mulling this over in my head, and I am feeling similar thoughts but are you able to tell us what spell crit soft and/or hard cap actually is?

    I don't know what the soft/hard cap is but i doubt anyone has attained it and i would guess spell crit's contribution will likely be reduced in 3.0 to make up for increasing stat values on gear.
    Haybale@Greybriar

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    Quote Originally Posted by fufi View Post
    What ? Shaman and Inquisitor are part of the specs with the highest need for CP in the game, considering how their crit chance is high and how it is forced around their burst.
    High crit % and forced crit% has NOTHING to do with the fact that SP scales extremely well in the cleric specs.

    And because SP scales extremely well, it has a high pull factor to overall dps. Warriors and rogues get weapon DPS scaling aswell as AP scaling, so the AP scaling is generally lower. That means CP tends to have a larger pull for warriors and rogues than AP.

    For this reason, CP isn't as highly valued for a cleric than it is for say, a warrior. Likewise, AP isn't as highly valued to warriors/rogues as it is to clerics/mages.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zehne View Post
    High crit % and forced crit% has NOTHING to do with the fact that SP scales extremely well in the cleric specs.

    And because SP scales extremely well, it has a high pull factor to overall dps. Warriors and rogues get weapon DPS scaling aswell as AP scaling, so the AP scaling is generally lower. That means CP tends to have a larger pull for warriors and rogues than AP.

    For this reason, CP isn't as highly valued for a cleric than it is for say, a warrior. Likewise, AP isn't as highly valued to warriors/rogues as it is to clerics/mages.
    CP heavily... heavily outweighs SP in Shaman
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  11. #11
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    CP to 1194 self buffed (with charred) or 1297 w/o a charred. After that, anything goes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by haybale View Post
    CP heavily... heavily outweighs SP in Shaman
    If you'll recall, I said that SP scales better for clerics for the most part.
    I also said that you shouldn't stack CP blindly because going over the cap is bad.
    I also said that you shouldn't put all your faith into CP. I've heard things like: "I'm going to keep using a crafted item instead of a T2 piece because it has 10CP more".

    Even if CP weighs in heavily for shaman, it doesn't make it the end all be all for 'cleric dps', especially since you won't be a shaman for every fight. Just because shaman can enjoy a good dps gain from CP, it doesn't mean Clerics find CP so highly valued that it's worth loosing all other stats.

    Too sum it all up: There is no one stat you can go for that will magically make you better. In everything there needs to be a balance. Generally speaking though, if you upgrade a piece of gear from one tier to a higher one, you won't ever go wrong. If you want to keep things simple, find the optimal amount of CP that won't hit the cap inside of a raid. Get close to it, but don't go over, and from there on out, stack SP.
    Please don't go quoting trying to find errors in posts. The intent was keep the "i've hit the crit cap"(outside of raids) and the "i'm using this piece because it has 10cp more"(with 50 primary stats less) to a minimum.

  13. #13
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    If you want to see how to maximize Spell Power to great effect for a Cleric, go 61 Inquisitor/8 Oracle/7 Shaman.

    Spell Power is uber for an Inq because it has several SP talents. So I prioritize Crit Power then Spell Power and ignore Spell Crit altogether.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zehne View Post
    If you'll recall, I said that SP scales better for clerics for the most part.
    But it doesn't. Where's your proof of this.
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  15. #15
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    I'm not sure this is out of line, or quite the opposite, but the original topic was SC vs CP, and it's sidelined to SP vs CP. Anyways, everyone assumed this was a topic about dps, probably b/c of the 2nd post. This may not be the case.

    As far as it goes, SP is the most utilized stat in Every cleric spec across the board in general. Cp only assists most in roles such as Dps and puri. SP shines in all the healing roles and in most the dps roles as well.

    So, to put it bluntly, unless you're 100% sure you're going to dps 100% the time, Stick with SP gear. Get a small bit of CP because it never hurts, but SP will be most utilized no matter the role(unless you're tank).

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