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Thread: I'm bad at shaman, stick to Druid?

  1. #1
    Plane Touched
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    Default I'm bad at shaman, stick to Druid?

    So I didnt return to the game until it went F2P, and Shaman is quite a bit more difficult than it was previously. While I realize that it's our highest dps spec, I just cant seem to love it, or play it well for that matter. Druid is in such a good place right now that I play it almost exclusively, except situations where being melee is very difficult.

    I would like to learn and understand Shaman better, for raiding purposes, if the experienced shamans have any suggestions. Ive read all the guides on these forums, but admittedly I had a hard time understanding some, it seems like English wasnt their first language. Currently, im using the less difficult 2 macro method until I get a better grasp on the spec. I'm weaving elemental/non elemental for the 30% bonus damage. Jolt is not in the macros, and I only use it when the bonus damage is up. So what am I missing? Im barely pulling 10k with Shaman, where in Druid I pull 13.5k - 14k with a lot less difficulty. I would like to avoid add ons (karuul, I believe its called?). I got a really bad virus off an add on very recently, and had to completely wipe my computer. So what id like to see is your macros, and in what order you use them with the instant cast spells such as lightning hammer, and the cooldowns. Lets keep it easy to understand too please, thats the whole reason im making this thread instead of following other guides written in gibberish. Help me not be bad, mmkay? While I fully expect to get flamed and told to "omg go find a guide", I would genuinely appreciate serious answers. Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoUseForAName View Post
    So I didnt return to the game until it went F2P, and Shaman is quite a bit more difficult than it was previously. While I realize that it's our highest dps spec, I just cant seem to love it, or play it well for that matter. Druid is in such a good place right now that I play it almost exclusively, except situations where being melee is very difficult.

    I would like to learn and understand Shaman better, for raiding purposes, if the experienced shamans have any suggestions. Ive read all the guides on these forums, but admittedly I had a hard time understanding some, it seems like English wasnt their first language. Currently, im using the less difficult 2 macro method until I get a better grasp on the spec. I'm weaving elemental/non elemental for the 30% bonus damage. Jolt is not in the macros, and I only use it when the bonus damage is up. So what am I missing? Im barely pulling 10k with Shaman, where in Druid I pull 13.5k - 14k with a lot less difficulty. I would like to avoid add ons (karuul, I believe its called?). I got a really bad virus off an add on very recently, and had to completely wipe my computer. So what id like to see is your macros, and in what order you use them with the instant cast spells such as lightning hammer, and the cooldowns. Lets keep it easy to understand too please, thats the whole reason im making this thread instead of following other guides written in gibberish. Help me not be bad, mmkay? While I fully expect to get flamed and told to "omg go find a guide", I would genuinely appreciate serious answers. Thanks in advance.
    The problem I have with this wall of text, is there is an entire SECTION of the forums titled "Cleric Guides", with several shaman guides with literally all of those answers. So yea I am going to tell you 'omg go find a guide'. lol.

  3. #3
    RIFT Guide Writer Redcruxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoUseForAName View Post
    I would like to avoid add ons (karuul, I believe its called?). I got a really bad virus off an add on very recently, and had to completely wipe my computer. So what id like to see is your macros, and in what order you use them with the instant cast spells such as lightning hammer, and the cooldowns. Lets keep it easy to understand too please, thats the whole reason im making this thread instead of following other guides written in gibberish. Help me not be bad, mmkay? While I fully expect to get flamed and told to "omg go find a guide", I would genuinely appreciate serious answers. Thanks in advance.
    I'm sorry that you got a virus, but are you *sure* it was from the addon and not any other source? Also, did you download the addon from a trusted site like Curse.com (which screens addons)?

    The reason why I ask is because I have a guide (in my sig) that uses karuul alert for an easy way to learn shaman.

    1000's of people download addons from curse without issue every day and curse even has a client program that you can put on your comptuer that will automatically download and install the addons you tell it to from their database that way you can be sure that you didn't accidentally click a phishing link.

    If you won't trust addon's no matter what then there is nothing you can do except learn to play shaman the hard way or stick with druid.


    Here is shaman as simple as i can give it:

    you'll have 2 macro's, a physical one and a magical one



    Physical

    #show Massive Blow
    suppressmacrofailures
    cast Massive Blow
    cast Combined Effort
    cast Crushing Blow
    cast Frozen Wrath
    cast Ekkehard's Grasp


    Magical
    #show Frozen Wrath
    suppressmacrofailures
    cast Frozen Wrath
    cast Glacial Strike
    cast Jolt
    cast Icy Blow
    cast Ekkehard's Grasp




    always use a magical attack before a physical attack so alternate magic <-> physical

    after massive blow use rush of strength to reset it's cooldown but make sure to use a magical attack before using MB again. (no physical skills back to back)

    if lightning hammer is not on your target, replace one of your magical attacks with it instead

    use both cooldowns (RotN and deep freeze) at the start of the fight before your first skills then only use them again once MB or frozen wrath is going to be your next attack (as you can see from the macro icons)

    Don't worry about maintaining vex or EoL because that would probably result in a DPS loss for you at this point

    the simple version start to the rotation:

    RotN, Deep freeze, frozen wrath -> Massive blow -> Lightning hammer, Rush of strength -> massive blow -> magical macro -> physical macro -> keep alternating
    Last edited by Redcruxs; 08-15-2013 at 05:28 AM.

  4. #4
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    Shaman will only be better than druid if you are playing it at is highest level of complexity (i.e. dont use the macros redcruxs posted above this). If you are willing to put the hours in to practice and master shaman it will be worth it. If you just want a simple rotation druid is probably best. I do recommend shaman though because it is a lot more fun that druid.
    Last edited by THEFUNKBOT; 08-15-2013 at 05:41 AM.

  5. #5
    RIFT Guide Writer Redcruxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THEFUNKBOT View Post
    Shaman will only be better than druid if you are playing it at is highest level of complexity (i.e. dont use the macros redcruxs posted above this).
    not exactly, your dps depends more on your type of gear and not screwing up

    If you have a lot of crit power (as a DPS'er should) then shaman pulls ahead as long as you don't screw up the rotation and cooldown usage, macro's or not. Not using macro's always has the potential to raise your dps but in a chaotic fight the simplicity of macro's usually lends itself to higher dps (less mistakes).

    If you stack spellpower (aka mainly are a healer) then druid will be a stronger choice unless you are really really good with shaman.

    Also, I agree shaman is way more fun
    Last edited by Redcruxs; 08-15-2013 at 05:51 AM.

  6. #6
    Plane Touched
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    Play what you enjoy. I always want to get into Shaman, but just don't have the patience to learn the rotation well (already have so many Warrior rotations to keep honed on my main). Druid, the way it is now, is just about exactly what I've wanted Druid to be so I stick with that for most things.

  7. #7
    Ascendant Stay's Avatar
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    It depends on your desired role.

    If you want to be main spec raid DPS, then it is your responsibility to learn the top DPS spec - shaman. You should gear your character towards it (crit power!) and you should download and learn to use karuul alert. It is not a virus. Try to learn how to set it up instead of just copying other people's alerts - if you don't know what you are doing, that is going to cause more problems than it solves.

    If you mostly heal or tank, or if you play everything equally, then I advise to stick with druid or inquisitor. They are as good or better than shaman in any situation except progression raiding. And if your raid does want you to DPS sometime, they are 'good enough' - you won't be top DPS but you can pull your weight. They are more straightforward, harder to mess up, don't need you to hound after crit power so much.
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  8. #8
    RIFT Guide Writer Redcruxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stay View Post
    It depends on your desired role.

    If you want to be main spec raid DPS, then it is your responsibility to learn the top DPS spec - shaman. You should gear your character towards it (crit power!) and you should download and learn to use karuul alert. It is not a virus. Try to learn how to set it up instead of just copying other people's alerts - if you don't know what you are doing, that is going to cause more problems than it solves.

    If you mostly heal or tank, or if you play everything equally, then I advise to stick with druid or inquisitor. They are as good or better than shaman in any situation except progression raiding. And if your raid does want you to DPS sometime, they are 'good enough' - you won't be top DPS but you can pull your weight. They are more straightforward, harder to mess up, don't need you to hound after crit power so much.
    your sig blew my mind...
    Last edited by Redcruxs; 08-15-2013 at 09:01 AM.

  9. #9
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    Thanks for the helpful replies. I didn't realize that shaman was so CP dependent, so that is pretty much not an option for me. I only have a few hundred crit power (I think about 350), so I suppose ill just stick with Druid. I already play 5 different specs, so its a lot to keep up with anyway. I am a min/maxer, but in this instance, it doesnt seem worth it to learn such a complex rotation for minimal gains.

    I will try the macros Redcruxs provided (thank you, by the way) and if it doesnt work out for me, ill turn it into a sentinel spec, since purifier is getting hit with the nerf bat.

  10. #10
    Plane Touched Arasaadi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoUseForAName View Post
    ill turn it into a sentinel spec, since purifier is getting hit with the nerf bat.
    ..just because the raid shielding is going away doesn't mean that Purifier is being nerfed. If anything, it'll be in a much better place than it was previously - even with the stupidly archaic 3 sec cast time.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arasaadi View Post
    ..just because the raid shielding is going away doesn't mean that Purifier is being nerfed. If anything, it'll be in a much better place than it was previously - even with the stupidly archaic 3 sec cast time.
    Raid shielding and group shielding. Theyre limiting the number of shields to 3, id say thats a pretty big nerf. From what ive seen of the changes, it doesnt look like it will be worth playing, at least in my opinion.

    At any rate, has anyone tried druid/justicar? Or is that totally overkill?

  12. #12
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    Well, it appears there is so little synergy with druid and justicar that its a waste of skill points. Hows the passive healing with salvation combined with the passive healing of the druids ability (cant remember the name of it), and if I put a point into reparation for the salvation to heal another ally (pet?) would that work, or do I need to take righteous mandate?

    I could see doing a 61 druid/9 sham/6 justicar if it were a soloing monster.

  13. #13
    Rift Disciple Oort's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoUseForAName View Post
    Well, it appears there is so little synergy with druid and justicar that its a waste of skill points. Hows the passive healing with salvation combined with the passive healing of the druids ability (cant remember the name of it), and if I put a point into reparation for the salvation to heal another ally (pet?) would that work, or do I need to take righteous mandate?

    I could see doing a 61 druid/9 sham/6 justicar if it were a soloing monster.
    Prior to the Druid rework, I was running Druid 51/Justicar 25/Defiler 0, and it was a soloing monster.

    Now, it's Druid 61/Shaman 13/Inquisitor 2, and it's still a soloing monster. Aid of the Forest completely makes Salvation/DoB unnecessary. Of course, if you let your pet die....

    While Shaman AE is vastly superior to Druid AE (50% better in my tests), Druid ST is close enough to Shaman, plus Druid has so much more survivability, that for anything but raid DPS, I go druid. Notably, Druid is a lot more versatile for GHs, with the ability to switch pets and/or be self-sustaining during phase 2.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Oort View Post
    Prior to the Druid rework, I was running Druid 51/Justicar 25/Defiler 0, and it was a soloing monster.

    Now, it's Druid 61/Shaman 13/Inquisitor 2, and it's still a soloing monster. Aid of the Forest completely makes Salvation/DoB unnecessary. Of course, if you let your pet die....

    While Shaman AE is vastly superior to Druid AE (50% better in my tests), Druid ST is close enough to Shaman, plus Druid has so much more survivability, that for anything but raid DPS, I go druid. Notably, Druid is a lot more versatile for GHs, with the ability to switch pets and/or be self-sustaining during phase 2.
    Aoe with Druid isnt bad, you just have to use the right pet. Tank pet or seer (the preferable choice) both do respectable AOE. Switching pets with a 3s cast is really not a big deal.

    I think im going to try a justicar variant. Its a dps loss for sure, but if salvation can heal the pet too, I see this spec being very powerful to solo with. Of course, ill keep my 61/13/2 spec for general use. Ill report back on my findings tomorrow.

  15. #15
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by NoUseForAName View Post
    Aoe with Druid isnt bad, you just have to use the right pet. Tank pet or seer (the preferable choice) both do respectable AOE. Switching pets with a 3s cast is really not a big deal.

    I think im going to try a justicar variant. Its a dps loss for sure, but if salvation can heal the pet too, I see this spec being very powerful to solo with. Of course, ill keep my 61/13/2 spec for general use. Ill report back on my findings tomorrow.
    It's still vastly inferior to shaman aoe, even with fae dispersion and spirit of cleave

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