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Thread: Defiler Improvement

  1. #16
    Sword of Telara Shibi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Runiez View Post
    And its the best healer for experts by a long mile only 2 enc i have to switch and that for grp/ae cleanse only.
    And you shouldn't need to switch in an expert, that is just bogus.

    Another player came up with a way to get past this so you could group cleanse in a heroic but not take away from the raiders who definitely don't want a defiler doing it.

    But without a cleric dev it won't get seen.

    Edit: I'm just tired of people saying, well you have to be a sentinel in order to heal a heroic. The game is beyond borked if that's the case.
    Last edited by Shibi; 01-07-2013 at 05:09 PM.
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  2. #17
    Ascendant Oblivion333's Avatar
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    Let the Defiler Queen of PvP respond.

    Healing is fine. Based on how you spec in, determines how much you will heal. Remember
    Defilers should not be your main healer (PvP wise), as their main purpose is to multi-task. Here are some suggestion that should addressed.

    1. Agree that links should be increased which will mean Defiler will intercept more damage which will make it more challenging as the defiler will need to ensure their health is not diminished.
    2. Bonds need to be increased to where they make a difference. Bonds don't impact a difference in a PvP raid setting unless you constantly spread it around.
    3. Also bonds should stack for other defilers in your team. Currently if a defiler adds a bond, the other defiler uses it and it doesn't stack.
    4. Why not have a bond in 1 button where all the bonds a executed oppose to having 3.
    5. I would like to have heals be controlled by the defiler based on their bonds and links. The less link and bonds the lower the heal, this will force the defiler to link and bond! I hate it when defilers don't bond or link!

    The problem to why people think Defilers are OP is their capability to instantly heal faster but the problem with a defiler just healing makes them a weak defiler as they need to constantly link and bond. If a defiler only heals w/o bonding or linking then they are fail because it is not all about heals with defilers.
    Last edited by Oblivion333; 01-07-2013 at 05:41 PM.

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  3. #18
    Official Rift Founding Fan Site Operator bctrainers's Avatar
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    I'd like to see the range spread of the "Unholy Nexus" greatly increased.
    --BC

  4. #19
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    Default possible add/changes .. and yes some have op potential but nothing others dont have )

    --Yes , some of these changes/adds have been suggested so sorry to keep that spam up, but here are a few changes or suggestions for defiler. (and yes i realize the scope of changes may be too much, but here they are)(and yes some are pulled specfically from other class/soul types mainly because they fit defiler playstyle and because we know it can be done since others have similar already). Also i did not list specific damage/heal amounts on some of these as it was the idea and concept vs actual amount i wanted to see what others thought (the specific on ones not stated can be filled by dev etc).

    -Rampant growth (make it a flat % for all links). perhaps 2/2 1= 30% 2= 70%
    -Higher lvl links override lower lvl versions.
    -An instant 30m ranged 10sec cd .. st heal spell -- make it an 8 pnt talent and make foul growth a 0 pnt talent.
    -A 26 pnt talent upper tree. 2/2 . making the insta spell above spread to 1pnt=2 2pnt=3players
    50% of what the insta heal does to main target.
    -An insta heal to links (all linked and the cleric also), 1 or 2 min cd, a 51+ pnt in root tree, massive heal.
    -Put Pain transmission on root tree 51 ability, and place Unholy nexus as the 41 upper tree ability.
    -Add an Ae cleanse (preferably for cleric + linked only -- to keep concept wise).
    -Delete or replace bond of corruption
    -Channeled ability, 30m, 1min cd, dmg target and heals cleric (and links).
    -Make foul growth procs on targets after the 3rd do minor heals or even a hot.
    -Add a zipit debuff everytime a party or raid member complains they are not seeing enough dps/hps on the meters from a defiler compared to full dps and raid healers, turns them into a toad for 3 seconds (just saying)

    Again these are just some suggestions, without specific numbers just to get them out there, and there are some previously suggested or may be considered too much or too odd.

    --Long live the Defilers.!!

  5. #20
    Sword of Telara Shibi's Avatar
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    All good ideas.

    The "Queen of PvP" (do you play that annoying little dwarf who eats me alive) and others.
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  6. #21
    Ascendant Stay's Avatar
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    The damage from links + self absorb mechanic isn't very fun. Either the damage is trivial and easily healed by passive/AoE heals, or the damage is dangerous and risks 1-shotting the defiler on any AoE damage mechanic. The self absorb either completely eliminates link damage without attention or risks death if not fastidiously maintained. There's very little middle ground, and neither extreme is fun.

    IMO get rid of the damage share and diversify the links. So there's one link to reduce damage, one to increase DPS, one to increase healing, etc. Could get really tricky and make one give runspeed or energy regen or extra range or such. As a drawback, make them reduce on the defiler what they buff on the target (tho maybe not as much). Or just make them less powerful but with no drawback at all. The fun part of the links is casting spells through them anyway, not just having them up for their passive effects.
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  7. #22
    Plane Touched starg's Avatar
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    Please, stop asking for more powerful tool for the defiler, we want a balanced soul, not something that's better than all the others.

    While i like the idea of having the foul growth being a hot and exploding at the end of the cooldown, or when you reach 3 stacks, each time a time should be applied, the stack is consumed and heal, i dont think we really need it, but i would really like to see something like that.

    I love the idea of interacting with our link, having more skills interacting with the links would be a great improvement for the defiler gameplay.

    The shared dmg, is, right now, what it should be to me, you still take dmg but you're not a people the other healers should look at, you're a healer like them, with some special mechanics.

    I would like to see more dps for the defiler but i think it would break the balance since it can already solo heal an expert dungeon while applying CS, reducing the chance of having anyone die (the links), and it does bring some dps, especially on trashes.

  8. #23
    Sword of Telara Shibi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starg View Post
    Please, stop asking for more powerful tool for the defiler, we want a balanced soul, not something that's better than all the others.
    No. We need something that's fun to play for way more people than just you and a handful of sentinals or whatever you like.

    Raiders are ruining the fun of the game for real people.
    Holding on to anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned.
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  9. #24
    Ascendant Eughe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stay View Post
    The damage from links + self absorb mechanic isn't very fun. Either the damage is trivial and easily healed by passive/AoE heals, or the damage is dangerous and risks 1-shotting the defiler on any AoE damage mechanic. The self absorb either completely eliminates link damage without attention or risks death if not fastidiously maintained. There's very little middle ground, and neither extreme is fun.

    IMO get rid of the damage share and diversify the links. So there's one link to reduce damage, one to increase DPS, one to increase healing, etc. Could get really tricky and make one give runspeed or energy regen or extra range or such. As a drawback, make them reduce on the defiler what they buff on the target (tho maybe not as much). Or just make them less powerful but with no drawback at all. The fun part of the links is casting spells through them anyway, not just having them up for their passive effects.
    That's my problem with defiler. It's mechanics are under utilized. It's more a set it and forget it in most situations.

    Links (and bonds) should play a more intricate part of defiler. We have a single attack that utilizes links and a single heal that does the same. I would think links and bonds would be more important and more utilized that it currently is.

    I'm still not satisfied with what defiler currently is. It being able to mitigate 30% damage is trivial as any and every soul could have had that feature and they seemingly designed encounters around that being in existence to force its use. Something I brought up in beta.


    It's too bad the soul may never be expanded upon.

  10. #25
    Ascendant Oblivion333's Avatar
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    I think defilers should have been a support class oppose to a heal/dps class. Because I found that defilers (whether they dps or heal or both) offers the team great support. In addition, I found that Defilers teaming with Cholormancers are a great pair. What makes the Defiler so different and unique is they can manifest into different roles that they need to play in the battlefield. Although I truly feel that bonds and links need an extra spice or something to make it worthwhile.

    Defilers IMO already acts as a support role as it spreads bonds, link players, and most importantly keep the healers alive. A good defiler will always pocket heal the healer as the healer heals the rest of the team.

    Pros: High Survivability, Instant Heals, Versatile where they can dps and heal.
    Cons: Complicated class, multi-tasking, and consumes too much mana when healing.

    Protip: Never instantaneously heal players as that is the main healer's job. Let the healers do their job, and make sure that the healers are healed. This way your healers will not worry about healing themselves.
    Last edited by Oblivion333; 01-08-2013 at 07:48 AM.

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  11. #26
    General of Telara Dyeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malark View Post

    Go to do some damage, you need a minimum of 3 GCD on damage to build up the Growth but.. tanks are generally taking damage all the time, even with a 30% reduction this can be a death sentence.
    Explosive growth (or hard casting FG before a fight starts) is a very useful tool.

  12. #27
    General of Telara Dyeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by starg View Post
    While i like the idea of having the foul growth being a hot and exploding at the end of the cooldown, or when you reach 3 stacks, each time a time should be applied, the stack is consumed and heal, i dont think we really need it, but i would really like to see something like that.
    No. Losing control over when my FG goes off is not a good thing. Most of the time it would either be all overheal or ~80% overheal. The point is to keep it rolling on your two tanks until it is needed, then pop it with a FB or GR when they take a big hit. If you need a hot, you have one that is just as powerful as HS in warden.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyeus View Post
    Explosive growth (or hard casting FG before a fight starts) is a very useful tool.
    you shouldnt have to spam explosive growth to heal effectivly, or have to spam only foul growth and apply it 3 itimes to someone you want to heal.

  14. #29
    Official Rift Founding Fan Site Operator bctrainers's Avatar
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    Just has an idea; Feast of the fallen. Why not make this a continuous aura that reduces incoming AOE damage abilities (not incoming ST damage) to the raid while active by 2% or 3%
    --BC

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dyeus View Post
    No. Losing control over when my FG goes off is not a good thing. Most of the time it would either be all overheal or ~80% overheal. The point is to keep it rolling on your two tanks until it is needed, then pop it with a FB or GR when they take a big hit. If you need a hot, you have one that is just as powerful as HS in warden.
    I would also agree that changing FG into a hot would be a waste, But as i said from the start of this thread the Defiler only needs to be able to control its heals better. I know some people think its fine as is and some raiders dont want to see a change, but to make defiler an effective healer in all aspects of the game these changes need to be made.

    Also that Hot that you are refering to is complete Trash till you get the raid crystal, which should not be the case.

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