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Thread: Noob question

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
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    Default Noob question

    I took a long break from Rift in September and recently came back. In trying relearn my toons and the changes that have taken place since i left, I am seeing a change that I can't quite figure out. In writing macros, why are reactives being placed at the end the cast sequences? For instance, in the "Jolt and Bolt" guide, I see that Jolt is always being placed last in the macro. Why wouldn't you place it first so that it is always checked to see if it is available to be cast?

    I know in my previous macros that anything that was reactive and a priority was placed first. Did something change in the way macros work?

    Confused........

  2. #2
    Sword of Telara meoka2368's Avatar
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    I don't play cleric much, but as mage I still do every "reactive" spell first.
    The only thing I can think of is there might be a long cooldown instant spell (or debuff) that is better than (or makes better) the reactive one in whatever macro you're using. That would explain why it is first.

  3. #3
    Plane Walker Kreiri's Avatar
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    Could be a macro for fast key mashing. Reactive spells are off GCD, aren't they? So they fire while GCD spells above them are on GCD.
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  4. #4
    MNM
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zycor View Post
    I took a long break from Rift in September and recently came back. In trying relearn my toons and the changes that have taken place since i left, I am seeing a change that I can't quite figure out. In writing macros, why are reactives being placed at the end the cast sequences? For instance, in the "Jolt and Bolt" guide, I see that Jolt is always being placed last in the macro. Why wouldn't you place it first so that it is always checked to see if it is available to be cast?

    I know in my previous macros that anything that was reactive and a priority was placed first. Did something change in the way macros work?

    Confused........
    It's off the gcd, so by spamming buttons youll use it right after or before the actual button you're bussing. Put it first in your BoJ macro though, else youll have to wait for the BoJ cast to finish.

  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    yeah, this is what has me confused. I took this from Amycus's Joltisitor Guide:

    Macros, rotation and buffs:

    As we are using Sanction Heretic (SH), Vex, Lightning Hammer (LH), Bolt of Judgement (BoJ) and Bolt of Depravity (BoD), you will just need a macro for every abilty including Jolt!

    So I would suggest you:

    #show Sanction Heretic
    cast Sanction Heretic
    cast Jolt

    #show Vex
    cast Vex
    cast Jolt

    #show Lightning Hammer
    cast Lightning Hammer
    cast Jolt

    #show Bolt of Judgement
    cast Bolt of Judgement
    cast Life's Vengeance
    cast Banish
    cast Massiv Blow
    cast Crushing Blow
    cast Jolt

    #show Bolt of Depravity
    cast Fanaticism
    cast Bolt of Depravity
    cast Jolt
    note the Bolt of Judgement macro has a lot of casts just to get down to the meat of the macro which is Jolt?

  6. #6
    MNM
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    All those are ignored because they are on the gcd though.

  7. #7
    Plane Walker
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    Simple solution
    Take Jolt outt of your macro, it's just one extra keybind...

    IIRC putting a reactive at the top of a macro in PvE is bad. If the server has to check it and see if it's active or not, then it can result in a serious dps loss... at least that's the reason I'm told Mages don't macro Inferno
    Doesn't matter what is put here, someone is going to @#%^& about it, regardless of what it is.

  8. #8
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by AWHavoc View Post
    Simple solution
    Take Jolt outt of your macro, it's just one extra keybind...

    IIRC putting a reactive at the top of a macro in PvE is bad. If the server has to check it and see if it's active or not, then it can result in a serious dps loss... at least that's the reason I'm told Mages don't macro Inferno
    Its a different reason, its like macroing rising waterfall or whatever the warrior ability is. It causes significant ability lag if the reactive or ability has to check for conditions before firing. IE: Mob is below 30% or has to be used as a follow up attack. Jolt doesn't cause this type of lag.

  9. #9
    Rift Master Merridwyn's Avatar
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    I'm pretty sure you should put Jolt before Bolt of Judgment though, as it's casted it doesn't have a GCD. Unless I'm horribly wrong. In all other instances though, reactives should go at the end to avoid lag and therefore a dps loss.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Merridwyn View Post
    I'm pretty sure you should put Jolt before Bolt of Judgment though, as it's casted it doesn't have a GCD. Unless I'm horribly wrong. In all other instances though, reactives should go at the end to avoid lag and therefore a dps loss.
    All of my macros for BnJ have jolt first on them and I seem to be about where I should be in DPS with the spec, so I don't believe it is a DPS loss to macro it first. You definitely don't want to wait in casting it since Jolt is such a high percent of your DPS in this spec.

  11. #11
    Rift Chaser
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    Default GCD lag

    ok so ive been playing with these types of abilities for a while and have tested this theory of where to place the off GCD ability. i used to have the Bolt 'n' Jolt build untill i was drafted in to tank and heal on the only fights i used it on....

    as for where to place Jolt, it should always go on the end of the macro (same as most reactive abilities) purely for the reason of the fact it is OFF the GCD. if you place it at the start of the macro and it becomes active just at the time the GCD finishes (remember Jolt does have a CD after using it) then it would use Jolt instead of an ability that triggers the GCD. this generates CD lag meaning that you can miss about 0.2-0.sec because you have to press the macro twice and it has to check twice for just one GCD.

    (Before you say i know the maths is bad but to give a rough example of how CD lag works)

    say if you are doing ~3000 dps and you get a 0.3sec lag, this could cost you 400~900 damage within that second/GCD.(making the assumption that the next 2 abilities are not crits and instant cast)

    this being said some abilities (like the druids Strength of the Fae or Inquisitors Fanatiscism) are useful at the start of a macro as you want the affects of the boost for the next ability(s) so the loss from CD lag can be forgotten about.
    Last edited by Fliptrik; 05-09-2012 at 04:11 AM.

  12. #12
    Soulwalker
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    ok, i get it. It is placed last based on the idea that you are spamming this key and firing off jolt during the GCD period and basically getting free dps and not burning up a gcd on network checks. Thanks for the great replies.

    Z

  13. #13
    MNM
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    In BnJ though, if you have any sort of ability queue you need to put it first in your BoJ macro since it's a cast.

  14. #14
    Ascendant
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    The reason oGCD abilities are placed last is so that if it's possible for one of your regular abilities to fire, you don't want a OGCD ability to fire for that key press. It creates lag as your second tap which triggers the GCD ability subsequently will be delayed, which costs DPS.

    i.e. if you had Jolt available and a regular cast available and Jolt first in the macro, you would cast Jolt instead of the ability. Usually, the GCD ability firing off "on time" is more important than the oGCD ability firing as soon as possible and delaying your global cooldown.

    (Not sure about Jolt in that spec since I haven't played it)

    For warriors in the old RW spec, this could cause significant DPS loss, so the oGCD abilities were always on the bottom, or more often, on a different key.

    Yes, it also causes a laggy feel in general for some people, and that's another reason.
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