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Thread: Is it worth it?

  1. #1
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    Default Is it worth it?

    I'm leveling my first cleric, i started as inquisitor but around level 18 i pretty much started running into the mana problem. bought a new role and went shaman, been running it and loving it since then, now i was wondering if Strike of Maelstrom is worth including in my single target DPS rotation...

    From my point of view, it does on-par damage with Crushing blow, but it doesn't trigger Long Memory, for for now i don't think it's worth it, but after i get Eye of the Storm with possibly StormBorn, is the dot worth the possible proc of Long Memory? Should i put it in my single target rotation?

    My current build
    Last edited by Xympa; 07-07-2011 at 06:01 AM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xympa View Post
    I'm leveling my first cleric, i started as inquisitor but around level 18 i pretty much started running into the mana problem. bought a new role and went shaman, been running it and loving it since then, now i was wondering if Strike of Maelstrom is worth including in my single target DPS rotation...

    From my point of view, it does on-par damage with Crushing blow, but it doesn't trigger Long Memory, for for now i don't think it's worth it, but after i get Eye of the Storm with possibly StormBorn, is the dot worth the possible proc of Long Memory? Should i put it in my single target rotation?

    My current build
    Yes, Strike of the Maelstrom (in a single target rotation) is worth it once you have Eye of the Maelstrom and Stormborn. What I did while leveling was put 1 point into Eye of the Maelstrom and Stormborn maxed. As I leveled and had more points available, I started working towards maxing out Eye of the Maelstrom and never looked back.

    As for your question whether or not it's worth using Strike of the Maelstrom over +1 Crushing Blow in hopes that Long Memory will proc, my answer is yes - use Strike of the Maelstrom anytime it's up. Even in a deep Shaman build where trying to proc Long Memory is a great idea, including Strike of the Maelstrom will help keep your sustained dps up, in case you happen to get RNG screwed.

    I'd also like to point out that Eye of the Maelstrom does 60% of Strike of the Maelstrom's damage. While this is obvious, what some people might miss is that Strike of the Maelstrom benefits from Lust for Blood. Adding LfB to the equation = 30% more damage to your Strike of the Maelstrom = the DoT portion will do even more damage.

    To me, all of the above far outweighs the 30% chance of getting Long Memory to proc.

    So in short, yes it's worth using Strike of the Maelstrom.
    Last edited by Miraodus; 07-07-2011 at 07:23 AM.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miraodus View Post
    Yes, Strike of the Maelstrom (in a single target rotation) is worth it once you have Eye of the Maelstrom and Stormborn. What I did while leveling was put 1 point into Eye of the Maelstrom and Stormborn maxed. As I leveled and had more points available, I started working towards maxing out Eye of the Maelstrom and never looked back.

    As for your question whether or not it's worth using Strike of the Maelstrom over +1 Crushing Blow in hopes that Long Memory will proc, my answer is yes - use Strike of the Maelstrom anytime it's up. Even in a deep Shaman build where trying to proc Long Memory is a great idea, including Strike of the Maelstrom will help keep your sustained dps up, in case you happen to get RNG screwed.

    I'd also like to point out that Eye of the Maelstrom does 60% of Strike of the Maelstrom's damage. While this is obvious, what some people might miss is that Strike of the Maelstrom benefits from Lust for Blood. Adding LfB to the equation = 30% more damage to your Strike of the Maelstrom = the DoT portion will do even more damage.

    To me, all of the above far outweighs the 30% chance of getting Long Memory to proc.

    So in short, yes it's worth using Strike of the Maelstrom.
    Thanks so much for the information, it really helped a lot, but I've been reading that nobody seems to really have much success with shamans regarding pvp even though they can do well in pve, i was thinking of trying out a druid focused spec and if anyone had any build for me to look at... Are the mechanics that different from shamans? Can clerics ever be successful and melee in pvp?
    Last edited by Xympa; 07-07-2011 at 10:23 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xympa View Post
    Thanks so much for the information, it really helped a lot, but I've been reading that nobody seems to really have much success with shamans regarding pvp even though they can do well in pve, i was thinking of trying out a druid focused spec and if anyone had any build for me to look at... Are the mechanics that different from shamans? Can clerics ever be successful and melee in pvp?
    Shaman doesn't have much success right now in PvP (or PvE) due to it's low damage output and lack of utility / escape tools. I enjoy playing on my Shaman spec as the challenge is rewarding. It's fun when you don't just steamroll over 5 people and can't just wade into the thick of battle without having to think first.

    As for a Druid spec, there are 2 popular specs at the moment but both are for PvE:
    31 Druid / 24 Shaman / 11 Inquis or 50 Druid / 16 Shaman.

    However, the only reason the above 2 specs are the most popular is because they put out the most damage, even if they may or may not be fun to play. As for the mechanics, not they aren't much different than a deep Shaman spec. You're still mashing a 1-button macro...you just have a pet to keep alive now and have to remember about 1 more cooldown - Rage of the Fae.

    Can melee clerics ever be successful in PvP? I'd say yes but not "right out of the gates". I'm currently R3 and have a moderate degree of success but have to work MUCH harder than my opponent(s). However, being a melee cleric has 2 main disadvantages:
    1) You'll receive grief from your teammates as you're only "hindering" your team by not being a healing spec.
    2) Being tied with the Cleric soul. Melee Clerics are MUCH weaker defensively (save for Justicar - though noone PvPs as deep Justicar) than their ranged or healing counterparts yet you will still be the #1 priority target since people don't like to take chances. If there's any potential that you COULD be a healer, they will wipe you out first. There have been a few matches I've been in where I'm 100% certain I had a "1" marked above my head, if only because I casted Healing Breath on myself.

    Melee Clerics in PvE are great fun (in my opinion) but their overall dps right now does not compete with Warriors, Rogues or Mages. In PvP, Melee Clerics are on an uphill battle but will have their place someday.
    Last edited by Miraodus; 07-07-2011 at 10:44 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miraodus View Post
    Shaman doesn't have much success right now in PvP (or PvE) due to it's low damage output and lack of utility / escape tools. I enjoy playing on my Shaman spec as the challenge is rewarding. It's fun when you don't just steamroll over 5 people and can't just wade into the thick of battle without having to think first.

    As for a Druid spec, there are 2 popular specs at the moment but both are for PvE:
    31 Druid / 24 Shaman / 11 Inquis or 50 Druid / 16 Shaman.

    However, the only reason the above 2 specs are the most popular is because they put out the most damage, even if they may or may not be fun to play. As for the mechanics, not they aren't much different than a deep Shaman spec. You're still mashing a 1-button macro...you just have a pet to keep alive now and have to remember about 1 more cooldown - Rage of the Fae.

    Can melee clerics ever be successful in PvP? I'd say yes but not "right out of the gates". I'm currently R3 and have a moderate degree of success but have to work MUCH harder than my opponent(s). However, being a melee cleric has 2 main disadvantages:
    1) You'll receive grief from your teammates as you're only "hindering" your team by not being a healing spec.
    2) Being tied with the Cleric soul. Melee Clerics are MUCH weaker defensively (save for Justicar - though noone PvPs as deep Justicar) than their ranged or healing counterparts yet you will still be the #1 priority target since people don't like to take chances. If there's any potential that you COULD be a healer, they will wipe you out first. There have been a few matches I've been in where I'm 100% certain I had a "1" marked above my head, if only because I casted Healing Breath on myself.

    Melee Clerics in PvE are great fun (in my opinion) but their overall dps right now does not compete with Warriors, Rogues or Mages. In PvP, Melee Clerics are on an uphill battle but will have their place someday.
    Thanks again for the informative post , i think i'll stick with shaman and if anyone ever complains about my dps in a dungeon i'll just change my role to inquisitor if it shuts them up, when i get to 50, i'll take the plunge and stick with whatever spec i decide.

    As far as people nagging about "hindering" the team for not being a healer, i feel ya, i remember when i played battlegrounds with my shadow priest there was always some ****** that expected me to heal him full time.

  6. #6
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    I was wondering if the other subsouls to shaman should include druid, the only beneficial thing i see are the critical talents and the insta-heal, should i instead choose inquis/cabalist or sent/inq or something else to pick the passive damage/crit increases, or are bombard and eruption of life that important to our dps?

    While leveling should i keep druid for the insta-heal, physical shield and critical hit?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xympa View Post
    I was wondering if the other subsouls to shaman should include druid, the only beneficial thing i see are the critical talents and the insta-heal, should i instead choose inquis/cabalist or sent/inq or something else to pick the passive damage/crit increases, or are bombard and eruption of life that important to our dps?

    While leveling should i keep druid for the insta-heal, physical shield and critical hit?
    Well I suppose that depends on what you need from your build. I've never done any testing myself but I'm quite certain that the lower your crit chance is, the better a Shaman/Druid/Inquis(or Sentinel) build is over the cookie-cutter 44 Shaman/11 Inquis/11 Sentinel build. My reasoning behind this: apparently when you get to 30% spell crit chance or greater, you have the highest chance of proccing and keeping Jolt on cooldown. 1 Jolt every 6 seconds is a very substantial dps increase over 1 Jolt per 12-15 seconds, ya catch my drift? That's what makes Spirit of the Hunter so valuable for leveling spec since your crit chance may hover around 15-20% for awhile without it. If your level 50 gear has you hovering around 25% crit chance, Spirit of the Hunter will see it's best use as it will push you up to that 'magical' 30% value.

    Once you are at 30% spell crit, I'm certain that switching to the Shaman/Inquis/Sentinel build will yield greater dps due to +60% crit damage (Crits will do 210% instead of the base 150%)

    If you're looking for a crit chance build, you could do X Shaman / 10(11) Druid / 6 Inquis (pick up Armor of Treachery) and use that. Right there is a very easy +7-8% crit and 170% crit damage. May not be the best for endgame but explore your options and see what works best for you. I put 11 Druid just in case you want to pick up Balm of the Woods for a little bit of self-healing. It's a 'nice to have' while leveling as it reduces the amount of time you have to sit down to recover health. Mana is a non-issue in a Shaman/Druid build due to Ageless Ice + Fae Hammer.

    As for Bombard and Eruption of Life, there was a time where I was "20 Druid / Rest in Shaman build" and let me tell you - between Vengeance of the Winter Storm + Crag Hammer + Eruption of Life 'ticks' plus Lightning Hammer DoT + Brutalize (from Shaman tree), it led to some REALLY nice consistent dps.
    Bombard by itself is a fantastic ability. When you get the talent that increase it's damage by 25%, it becomes one of your hardest hitting attacks - I think it's only bested by Jolt (that has 5 points put into Stormborn).

    Hope this helps!
    Last edited by Miraodus; 07-08-2011 at 07:01 AM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Miraodus View Post
    Well I suppose that depends on what you need from your build. I've never done any testing myself but I'm quite certain that the lower your crit chance is, the better a Shaman/Druid/Inquis(or Sentinel) build is over the cookie-cutter 44 Shaman/11 Inquis/11 Sentinel build. My reasoning behind this: apparently when you get to 30% spell crit chance or greater, you have the highest chance of proccing and keeping Jolt on cooldown. 1 Jolt every 6 seconds is a very substantial dps increase over 1 Jolt per 12-15 seconds, ya catch my drift? That's what makes Spirit of the Hunter so valuable for leveling spec since your crit chance may hover around 15-20% for awhile without it. If your level 50 gear has you hovering around 25% crit chance, Spirit of the Hunter will see it's best use as it will push you up to that 'magical' 30% value.

    Once you are at 30% spell crit, I'm certain that switching to the Shaman/Inquis/Sentinel build will yield greater dps due to +60% crit damage (Crits will do 210% instead of the base 150%)

    If you're looking for a crit chance build, you could do X Shaman / 10(11) Druid / 6 Inquis (pick up Armor of Treachery) and use that. Right there is a very easy +7-8% crit and 170% crit damage. May not be the best for endgame but explore your options and see what works best for you. I put 11 Druid just in case you want to pick up Balm of the Woods for a little bit of self-healing. It's a 'nice to have' while leveling as it reduces the amount of time you have to sit down to recover health. Mana is a non-issue in a Shaman/Druid build due to Ageless Ice + Fae Hammer.

    As for Bombard and Eruption of Life, there was a time where I was "20 Druid / Rest in Shaman build" and let me tell you - between Vengeance of the Winter Storm + Crag Hammer + Eruption of Life 'ticks' plus Lightning Hammer DoT + Brutalize (from Shaman tree), it led to some REALLY nice consistent dps.
    Bombard by itself is a fantastic ability. When you get the talent that increase it's damage by 25%, it becomes one of your hardest hitting attacks - I think it's only bested by Jolt (that has 5 points put into Stormborn).

    Hope this helps!
    I bought a new role and tried the Inq/Sent build, was definitely doing more damage, but i found myself in more "Holy **** I'm gonna die" situations because i sorely miss Shield of Oak, and it comes in soooo handy in open world pvp if you find a melee guardian with enough balls to attack you.

    End game i will definitely take the Inq/Sent path (unless something changes till i reach 50, 31 currently), but for now i'll keep my Druid/Sent while leveling, will try and parse 2 5-mans with the 2 specs and compare them thou.

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