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Thread: Justicar Tanking question

  1. #1
    Shadowlander Valarouko's Avatar
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    Default Justicar Tanking question

    I always read about how we only get so much magic prevention. About 28% using base justicar and shaman talents. What my question is how does the +10% heals given from shaman add on to this? This has to have some kind of mitigation factor that is not counted for by the theory crafters. If we were to get the same mitigation as warrior, wouldn't that make us BETTER at taking magical damage? I honestly don't know how it factors in...

    Also, did they say when they were going to fix us?

    Thanks

  2. #2
    RIFT Community Ambassador Radak's Avatar
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    Default

    Some one recently asked a near identical question so I will just copy my reply from their.
    Also most people aren't asking to have identical magic mitigation as warriors/rogues but just being more viable with only 10-15% more magic damage taken.

    Quote Originally Posted by JusticarToki View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Radak View Post
    Well lets see we got 15% from Shield of Faith, 3% from tick skinned and 10% from the new Thorvin's Law.

    What we get is this 1-((1-0.15)*(1-0.03)*(1-0.1))=25.79% less magic damage taken.

    Accoding to Ciderhelm who is the warrior equivalent of me a correctly specced warrior has the following:
    Void with talent 20%, Imbued armor 5%, Crest mastery 9%, Hardened will 9%, Power of the masses up to 10%

    What they get is this 1-((1-0.2)*(1-0.05)*(1-0.09)*(1-0.09)*(1-0.1))=43.36% less magic damage taken. (this is equal to the value ciderhelm gives for this spec)

    Now you can say that's only 43.36-25.79=17.57% more damage taken. However this is not the case.

    To make this clear we make a easy example.
    A boss does an attack that deal 10k magic damage.
    The warrior will take 10000*(1-0.4336)=5664 damage
    A cleric will take 10000*(1-0.2579)=7421 damage

    Now if we look at the difference that's 7421-5664= 1757 more damage
    1757 / 5664 = 31.0% more damage taken.

    And 31% more damage taken is still far to big of a difference (against a rogue it's even more at around 37%).
    Radak,

    Can you reference the extra healing from the Shammy tree?

    Do the warriors get this at all? Does this effect the end result of the clerics health pool versing the other tanks?
    First of in the magic tanking spec warriors do not have the increased healing taken. As it's only on the warlord souls which is not used in that build.

    The second thing is it's really hard to give a value to it. First lets look at two extremes:
    First if it's a really big hit that will simple instantly kill us before healers even have the time to react so then it does nothing at all. Here a 10% less damage taken might just have saved your live.
    Now if it is a slow incoming stream of damage it's still far worse then 10% less damage taken as there will be a lot of overhealing from the healers. In this case the 10% less damage taken also doesn't do that much and they will be about equal. But in this case magic damage isn't a problem and will never kill us.

    Only when the damage is higher enough to not have overhealing (or less then 10%) but slow enough to not kill us in 1-2 hits will it have any real effect. And as a result it's far worse then taking 10% less damage as it often does nothing. Also note when there is a healing debuff like greenscale the more healing taken simple does far less then taking 10% less damage.

    However even if we fully take it into account at the same level as 10% less damage taken we are still looking at this:
    1-((1-0.15)*(1-0.03)*(1-0.1)*(1-0.1))=33.22%

    And we would still be taking 17.9% more damage as a result. But like I said the 10% more healing taken unfortunately simple is far inferior to 10% less damage taken.
    Last edited by Radak; 06-26-2011 at 12:25 PM.
    Cleric tanking: Justicar guide | Justicar spreadsheet and item list
    Defence is as much a part of war as offense, the shield as important a tool as the sword.

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