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Thread: Is there a spot in a raid for a full warden healer?

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    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Default Is there a spot in a raid for a full warden healer?

    There's no denying sent/purifer has been predominantly proved to be the best healing spec all round for PvE, but could you possibly have a dedicated fully built warden?

    Considering you're looking at 4-5 healers in a raid. If you had around 3-4 chloro and pur/sent healers in a raid (a mix of both depending) and then have one person focus on warden. Is this viable?

    I'm not even suggesting going full warden, but close to. Considering you're getting no huge benefits from other trees due to this, where you put the talents after this isn't too big of a deal. Maybe even put 12 points in inquisitor for purge as I hear not many souls have this ability, then the rest in sentinel for the instant cast?

    With this many points in warden, you're HoTs will actually be pretty dam good, and far better than the AoE talents you get in sentinel (3.5% increase per point, rather than 1%). I can imagine there being pretty good group heals and mana regen with this build too, while keeping soothing stream stacked up on most tanks.

    The rest of your healers can then really focus on being what their good at, focus the tank and spread healing through tank buffs.

    A possible spec, although some might find it a bit silly. I really can't see this spec failing in 5 man experts.

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00....xEbpqtRqz.x0V

    or even more AoE healing:
    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00Gej..EEdtqtRqz.x0Vx

    Anyway I'm not 50 yet, but I'm definitly giving it a go :P


    Oh and finally my bonus PvE raid healing spec (you got to love it):

    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00...0x0o.xEbpqtRqz
    Last edited by Refuge; 03-23-2011 at 05:04 PM.

  2. #2
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    There's no denying sent/purifer has been predominantly proved to be the best healing spec all round for PvE,...
    I would be interested reading about it.
    link(s) ?

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    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jt-brako View Post
    I would be interested reading about it.
    link(s) ?
    There's plenty of links around the first few pages of cleric forums showing how this is usually the most effective.

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    Telaran Brap's Avatar
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    I was under the impression that people just prefer to not be bothered with managing HoTs, not that Warden was worse than the other two specs. I've seen plenty of discussion and I don't recall anyone saying that Purifier or Sentinel was better number-wise.

    Warden is more mana efficient, at the cost of being more of a pain to do effectively.

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    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brap View Post
    I was under the impression that people just prefer to not be bothered with managing HoTs, not that Warden was worse than the other two specs. I've seen plenty of discussion and I don't recall anyone saying that Purifier or Sentinel was better number-wise.

    Warden is more mana efficient, at the cost of being more of a pain to do effectively.
    Well yes this is true. But without a lot of points in Warden I feel AoE healing lacks with warden. Simple HoTs dont do much. The only powerful healing with Warden is the soothing stream/deluge combo.

    Therefore sentinel/purifer is better for this, plus they have more crucial life saving spells.

    If you f*ck up as a warden, you're pretty messed up. If you're silenced in a fight, your stacks go, therefore making you really weak for the first 8 seconds, your tank could die in this time.

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    Rift Chaser
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brap View Post
    I was under the impression that people just prefer to not be bothered with managing HoTs, not that Warden was worse than the other two specs. I've seen plenty of discussion and I don't recall anyone saying that Purifier or Sentinel was better number-wise.

    Warden is more mana efficient, at the cost of being more of a pain to do effectively.
    No, the general concensus is that wardens have a much harder time handling burst damage on tanks, especially in higher tier dungeons/raids. However, they are amazing group/raid healers. Always a place in a raid for them imo. I would rather a mage focused on dps anyways, rather than healing. Same with rogues

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    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by torm3nt View Post
    No, the general concensus is that wardens have a much harder time handling burst damage on tanks, especially in higher tier dungeons/raids. However, they are amazing group/raid healers. Always a place in a raid for them imo. I would rather a mage focused on dps anyways, rather than healing. Same with rogues
    Well if you do the maths deluge is actually stronger than any 3 second heal cast when it comes to hps (if you have the HoT's stacked). But it depends on when the tank gets spiked and what heals your mid casting. Obviously if the 3 second cast is near completion this is more viable, but you're more likely to finish a deluge quicker.

    Again, Warden group heals suck until you put a good number of points in it therefore losing out on duo specs such as warden/sentinel. Where you can get an instant cast 3 second heal and the benefits of deluge.

    So ye, full warden great for raids? Not so great for spike damage.
    Warden/Sent good for spike damage. Not so great for AoE heals :/


    And, chloro mages are the best healers of them all
    Last edited by Refuge; 03-23-2011 at 06:23 PM.

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    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brap View Post
    I was under the impression that people just prefer to not be bothered with managing HoTs, not that Warden was worse than the other two specs. I've seen plenty of discussion and I don't recall anyone saying that Purifier or Sentinel was better number-wise.

    Warden is more mana efficient, at the cost of being more of a pain to do effectively.
    A large part is also that the UI is completely crap for keeping track of HoT's, making life as a Warden needlessly difficult.

  9. #9
    Soulwalker Himesama's Avatar
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    Theres always room for any good player in a raid. So of course if you play a kickbutt warden, then ofcourse its viable.

  10. #10
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    There's no denying sent/purifer has been predominantly proved to be the best healing spec all round for PvE [...]
    Having healed through most of non raid content (successfully, mind you) as a warden, I'm most intrigued by this statement.
    Last edited by Rakimou; 03-24-2011 at 01:35 AM.

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    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by jt-brako View Post
    I would be interested reading about it.
    link(s) ?
    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    There's plenty of links around the first few pages of cleric forums showing how this is usually the most effective.
    I'm intrigued aswell. I mainly saw complaints about mana issues about this spec in the threads.
    So no, I don't get your statement. And yes, I run (as many others), warden/sent.

  12. #12
    Plane Touched Weez's Avatar
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    I can't speak for raids yet as I'm just now approaching them, but I have healed all the way from lvl 1 as a full Warden and have had no issues. I would honestly question a raid leader who says there's no space for a Warden.

    Put a Warden + a sentinel/purifier on the main tank with the Warden doing HoTs and the other doing the big heals and you'll be alright. HoT healers are indispensable in a raid. With our Ripple and AoE abilities, you can also heal AoE damage (yes, bards & Chloros can do it too).

    Can the entire raid be Warden? Prob not. But any Raid leader who refuses to take 1-2 full Wardens to a raid would need to L2P, imo.


    + we even have breathe under water buff! duh!
    See our RIFT guides for Shaman, Archon, Chloromancer, Bard and more.

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    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weez View Post
    I can't speak for raids yet as I'm just now approaching them, but I have healed all the way from lvl 1 as a full Warden and have had no issues. I would honestly question a raid leader who says there's no space for a Warden.

    Put a Warden + a sentinel/purifier on the main tank with the Warden doing HoTs and the other doing the big heals and you'll be alright. HoT healers are indispensable in a raid. With our Ripple and AoE abilities, you can also heal AoE damage (yes, bards & Chloros can do it too).

    Can the entire raid be Warden? Prob not. But any Raid leader who refuses to take 1-2 full Wardens to a raid would need to L2P, imo.


    + we even have breathe under water buff! duh!
    I've not done end game raid content, but in the t1 stuff warden is good enough. Before I got my tanking gear I healed, and healed as warden. Was it work yes, did I have close calls yes. All you have to do is keep orbs on tank, refresh hots before a big heal no matter what time is on it=win

    oh and btw ripple is an amazing skill for aoe healing

  14. #14
    Plane Touched
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    I am surprised more haven"t mentioned the Orbs. They heal for a ton of damage, and are only on a 45 second timer. Combine that, and the insta heals from Sent, and you have a very viable build. I have not done T2 content yet, but everything up to this point has been a breeze as a full Warden/Sent.

  15. #15
    Rift Chaser Daberu's Avatar
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    Here is my build for warden at level 50:


    http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=00xej..EEdtqtRqz.V0Vx

    I do have a question: Does Surging Rapids affect Downpour? Downpour is channeled but is an instant cast...

    This build gives me 60% increased HoT healing (due to Ocean's Blessing ), as well as 10% increased healing from HoTs, 15% increased healing from instant casts, 10% increased max mana, 5% increased spellpower, 5% increased healing from Aoe heals, and 10% reduced mana cost.

    Adding all this up, Healing spray should heal for, if the cleric has about 1k spellpower (which Im not sure if that's possible yet):

    472 (initial) + 283.2 (ocean's blessing) + 118 (25% from talents) + 1050 (5% sp bonus)... = 1923.2 over 12 seconds.

    This means about 480.8 healing per tick, but this is without bard/archon buffs and other raid buffs and so on so it could be much higher than this!

    I would say if you know how to play them, they can be very powerful.

    Edit: I didn't include the other spells becuase I just wanted to give an example of how powerful warden's HoT's can be at 50, so i just chose healing spray.
    Last edited by Daberu; 03-24-2011 at 07:54 AM.

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