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Thread: Waited until 40... Champions are pretty balanced lol

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple Spug's Avatar
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    Default Waited until 40... Champions are pretty balanced lol

    AoE Root/Fear
    Multiple Stuns
    100% Uptime Snare
    6 Second CD Interrupt off the GCD
    Targeted Knockback
    15 second CD charge that roots and stuns
    50% Healing Reduction debuff
    Plate armor, high mitigation, high HP

    And the best part:

    On demand break of Stuns, Snares, Roots, and Disarms on a 30 second CD.

    All reactive abilities can be macro'd in with their regular abilities thus requiring no timing or skill whatsoever.

    When a Champion charges me I may as well just walk away from my computer.

    I know I'm not level 50, but you dont need to be 50 to see that a class with that many tools, that is also critting me harder than any class I've run into yet period, and has 100% target uptime with a 50% auto-apply Healing debuff is going to be stupid overpowered.

    I mean seriously.

    Seriously?

    This isn't even factoring in the synergies with other Souls, which makes it even worse. Wtf is going on?
    "The problem is that the people with the most ridiculous ideas are always the people who are most certain of them."

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spug View Post
    Plate armor, high mitigation, high HP
    Just in response to this threefold sentence:

    Yes.
    No, a 20% more physical mitigation than cloth at 42 is not HIGH mitigation.
    No. 240 more hps at 42 compared to rogues with equal gear (full blue armor) is certainly HIGH in a margin of 3-4k health pool.

    Remember you are talking about a DPS speced warrior here with 2h weapon and focused on str/dex.

  3. #3
    Rift Disciple Spug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delolith View Post
    Just in response to this threefold sentence:

    Yes.
    No, a 20% more physical mitigation than cloth at 42 is not HIGH mitigation.
    No. 240 more hps at 42 compared to rogues with equal gear (full blue armor) is certainly HIGH in a margin of 3-4k health pool.

    Remember you are talking about a DPS speced warrior here with 2h weapon and focused on str/dex.
    At 40, the Champions I'm running into are spotting about 800 more HP than me, and 20% more mitigation is still 20% more mitigation. It is higher than say, anything that doesn't also wear plate. Also, I see a lot of Rogues stacking pretty heavy endurance. They also hit like wet noodles because of it. A good DPS Rogue will be further out than 240 HP, but I digress.

    If you think having everything I stated isn't incredibly over the top, then we'll never agree anyways.
    "The problem is that the people with the most ridiculous ideas are always the people who are most certain of them."

  4. #4
    Shield of Telara Fluffycalico's Avatar
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    as I said in your other thread ...if you are pvping use a pvp soul. Then none of what you listed is an issue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spug View Post
    At 40, the Champions I'm running into are spotting about 800 more HP than me, and 20% more mitigation is still 20% more mitigation. It is higher than say, anything that doesn't also wear plate. Also, I see a lot of Rogues stacking pretty heavy endurance. They also hit like wet noodles because of it. A good DPS Rogue will be further out than 240 HP, but I digress.

    If you think having everything I stated isn't incredibly over the top, then we'll never agree anyways.
    I didn't even comment on your other assessment. I am nitpicking really wrong statements/phrases. That is all.

    Also if your Champion you are running with has 800 more HPs than you...he is either not doing his job as well as he could if he is a DPS warrior...or your gear difference is VAST.

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple Spug's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fluffycalico View Post
    as I said in your other thread ...if you are pvping use a pvp soul. Then none of what you listed is an issue.
    It's still a huge issue, what are you talking about?

    The reason being is this isn't a one trick pony class that relies on a single burst window that you can magically survive through with the PvP soul, or relies on a single CC to set up a kill.

    This is a class that sits on a target with 100% uptime and PvE's it and is designed that way, with a baffling amount of crowd control that a single break on a long cooldown in my PvP soul wont counter.

    I realize there's some talents that will prolong the pain, but no definitive counter at all to all of the tools this class has, let alone just one or two of them.

    You can look at it and theorycraft it any way you like. A class with that many tools in a single tree is going to be very, very imba. Especially with a coordinated healer.

    And I dont have another thread regarding this issue.
    "The problem is that the people with the most ridiculous ideas are always the people who are most certain of them."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spug View Post
    It's still a huge issue, what are you talking about?

    The reason being is this isn't a one trick pony class that relies on a single burst window that you can magically survive through with the PvP soul, or relies on a single CC to set up a kill.

    This is a class that sits on a target with 100% uptime and PvE's it and is designed that way, with a baffling amount of crowd control that a single break on a long cooldown in my PvP soul wont counter.

    I realize there's some talents that will prolong the pain, but no definitive counter at all to all of the tools this class has, let alone just one or two of them.

    You can look at it and theorycraft it any way you like. A class with that many tools in a single tree is going to be very, very imba. Especially with a coordinated healer.

    And I dont have another thread regarding this issue.
    I would understand if you played a DPS focused caster and complained. But to me it seems you are playing a rogue.

    If you are playing a rogue and you are loosing to a Champion in small scale fights...you are playing the wrong type of rogue. NB/Assa can rip through Champions. Twilight Transcendence, Twilight Shelter, Side Steps, Slip Away should be enough to whack whatever you find in your wake.
    Last edited by Delolith; 03-01-2011 at 03:53 AM.

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    Rift Chaser
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    Made a thread in the warrior forum few days ago predicting that nerf chamption threads would come up to replace riftblade whine thread. And i was correct.

    Sometimes i hate myself for always being proven right. When champions eventually get nerfed because of mages we will switch to paragon or some other soul and before long you will come in here and whine about that soul.

  9. #9
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spug View Post
    AoE Root/Fear
    Multiple Stuns
    100% Uptime Snare
    6 Second CD Interrupt off the GCD
    Targeted Knockback
    15 second CD charge that roots and stuns
    50% Healing Reduction debuff
    Plate armor, high mitigation, high HP

    And the best part:

    On demand break of Stuns, Snares, Roots, and Disarms on a 30 second CD.
    1: multiple stuns? charge stun upto 3 secs for 2 points, hmmm anything else, not that i can think of, that sure was alot of stuns.

    2: snare, true.... but since we're melee then we kinda need a snare to counter some classes speed increases and/or snares.

    3: interrupt, allways a nice thing, but aint something gamebreaking, and afaik then others with a interrupt aint affected by gcd aswell.

    4: targeted knockback, allways nice, but. why knock someone away from you that you're trying to kill?

    5: see point 1, 3 sec stun for 2 points.

    6: healing debuff, allways nice vs a healer, but for it to work we need to crit, and a champion dont get any crit from talents/buffs (other then Prober timing(30 sec cd when 4 points is spent), so it aint allways it's up on people.

    7: plate armor, right. dont matter when most classes isent dealing physical dmg.
    high mitigation, again it wont help vs the majority of players since they deal elemental dmg.
    high hp, true. we seem to have a larger hp pool then most others at a equal level.

    so to end this, champions have alot of tools to use, but at a cost, all of the things you "complain" about cost points. and incase you havent noticed before, then the champion is a "pvp" soul.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looney View Post
    4: targeted knockback, allways nice, but. why knock someone away from you that you're trying to kill?
    I find your lack of imagination disturbing.

  11. #11
    Plane Touched CaptainMcCloud's Avatar
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    I have "Prepare your ANUS!" bound to my Proper Timing ---> Titan's Strike macro. It gives you something to laugh at as you're being killed while in the 5-second stun.
    Mateo of HC/TSG - Long Live The Syndicate!

  12. #12
    Telaran
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    This thread is a joke. Wait till your 50 and see the spam of CC there is when it's 10 on 10 in a small warfront like black garden. All your QQing isn't going to change that this class isn't OP, it just takes less skill to play with how the if/then macros work

  13. #13
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banaghran View Post
    I find your lack of imagination disturbing.
    You mean....you could....knock people away from their teammates into a big ball of melee death out of range of healers and they could die?!

    No, the only way this skill can be used is to knock other melee back away from you. We do not allow creative, if obvious, pvp uses of skills 'round these parts.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looney View Post
    1: multiple stuns? charge stun upto 3 secs for 2 points, hmmm anything else, not that i can think of, that sure was alot of stuns.

    2: snare, true.... but since we're melee then we kinda need a snare to counter some classes speed increases and/or snares.

    3: interrupt, allways a nice thing, but aint something gamebreaking, and afaik then others with a interrupt aint affected by gcd aswell.

    4: targeted knockback, allways nice, but. why knock someone away from you that you're trying to kill?

    5: see point 1, 3 sec stun for 2 points.

    6: healing debuff, allways nice vs a healer, but for it to work we need to crit, and a champion dont get any crit from talents/buffs (other then Prober timing(30 sec cd when 4 points is spent), so it aint allways it's up on people.

    7: plate armor, right. dont matter when most classes isent dealing physical dmg.
    high mitigation, again it wont help vs the majority of players since they deal elemental dmg.
    high hp, true. we seem to have a larger hp pool then most others at a equal level.

    so to end this, champions have alot of tools to use, but at a cost, all of the things you "complain" about cost points. and incase you havent noticed before, then the champion is a "pvp" soul.
    OMG. Are all warriors this brain dead? This guy is really, honestly saying that champ has ONLY ONE stun. What a piece of work. Dude. Seriously. Read the tooltips of your own abilities instead of simply rolling your face on your macro keyboard. You list your points with numbers like you actually know anything and you invalidate yourself with your very first point.

    Check out what a dps warrior that is not brain dead had to say just a few posts after your failure of a reply.

    I have "Prepare your ANUS!" bound to my Proper Timing ---> Titan's Strike macro. It gives you something to laugh at as you're being killed while in the 5-second stun.
    Can you read that or you need help? I can help.
    laugh at as you're being killed while in the 5-second stun.
    Is that too long for you? i can make it shorter.

    killed while in the 5-second stun.
    Are you now being sidetracked or trying to side track to obfuscate from your error? We can make it right to the point.

    5-second stun.
    In case you are still confused it is Titan Strike and it is a core champion ability. Go on and start talking crap about how you can't die in 5 seconds. Yes, oh yes, most certainly yes you can. If you need me to i will link several videos from beta 7 where people where killed in far fewer than 5 seconds.

    Also while you are learning something about the game... rogues get TWO stuns that add up to 8 seconds. It is the most you can do... outside of a slip-away reapply issue. The CHAMP has the same stunlock as the rogue. The assassin jewel of a stun is 4 seconds. Your charge is 3. 3 second stun on a 15 second cd is very powerful. The rogue cd is 30 seconds. Cd time is doubled... but the effect is NOT doubled. It would have to be 6 seconds for that. This is all in the champ soul. If you want you can also go into the paladin soul and you can pick up a stun for only 11 points invested AND a heal to full instant get out of death free card at 8.

    I play warrior.

  15. #15
    Soulwalker
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    I have a lvl 35 warr and can say that without a healer I wont go into a WF.. Champs are great IF you have a healer..

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