+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Spell casting limitations

  1. #1
    Champion of Telara Nightbringer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Overthere
    Posts
    1,201

    Default Spell casting limitations

    One of the big limitations in games like EQ and EQ2 is that casters must remain stationary while casting spells while melee classes are free to move while using their abilities.As a comparison, some game, like DDO, allow a caster to move while casting. With DDO, a caster can cast while moving, but with the restriction of moving at a reduced speed. I was curious which model Rifts was leaning towards.

    Some games require components, regents, or focus items for some or all spells. Are these going to be a part of Rifts?

    Are spellcasters going to have the option for magic based ranged attacks with little to no mana cost, or are they going to stand around and do nothing after depleting their mana while the melee classes can swing a sword all day long? I'm not asking for huge damage off a mana-free spell, only the ability to at least make a meaningful contribution. These mana-free spells could be for half the damage the caster would otherwise be capable of dealing, and even be tied to items.

    What kind of casting times are we going to be talking about and how easy will it be to disrupt a casters spells? In EQ2 it is nearly trivial for a melee to interrupt, stifle, stun, or otherwise disrupt a caster once they close. Combine this with 80% run speed buffs, line of sight requirements, relatively short spell ranges, and the requirement to remain stationary and casters get maybe one spell off before they are engaged in hand-to-hand. This is no joke, I've been running battlefields in EQ2 all day, from the time a buffed melee enters spell range till they engage is about equal to the casting time of either my snare or my root spell.

    How effective are resists going to be? Are casters going to be able to build to overcome resists? In EQ, once player resists got past a certain point, they were effectively immune to player cast spells. I am not asking for resists to be done away with, only for the caster to have the ability to build to overcome them, in the same manner that people worried about spells can built to resist them. (I kid you not. Magicians in EQ had resist debuffs, even using them, my wife was capable of resisting 95% of the spells thrown at her. This was as per parses involving thousands of casts. Only physical attacks where effective vs. other players.)

  2. #2
    Soulwalker NoctemLupus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Montana
    Posts
    4

    Default

    I was wondering the same thing.

    If there are induction times, hopefully they will be somewhat balanced and not a "push hotkey #3... get a drink of juice... mmm goood juice" oh nice induction over

    in asheron's call you could do things like slide casting where once the relatively small induction time, (no induction bar , the induction was literally the time for the animation event to finish) , once that induction finished you were free to move around while the spell animation went off. It was actually a pretty decent system (the reason it was called slide casting is because turbine never finished the animation so while you were casting you could literally "slide" along the ground ).

    hopefully someone can answer as to the effects of resists and inductions, as i most certainly will start with some sort of caster.

  3. #3
    Sword of Telara souper's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    831

    Default

    Many of your points have been brought up before. We don't have too many concrete answers since few people have actually played the game and most of those were professional game sites. You can check out this video to see a tiny bit of caster footage and draw some conclusions for yourself.

    My observations were: It seems like you'll have to stand still for non-instant spells. There didn't seem to be a hard-interrupt when hit by damage nor was there any push-back. Dunno anything about regents and don't know anything about resists. As far as being useless without mana, well, the class system may help with that. Just adopt a secondary class that is less mana-intensive (assuming there is one) and it might lessen the problem.

    Do keep in mind this is early footage and anything you see may or may not change.

  4. #4
    Plane Walker Fayde's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    385

    Default

    I read ff14 you have a skill that allows you to cast when moving at the cost of using i think it was double or the MP cost.

    We could have some thing like that you could cast and move but suffer with much higher mp costs and maybe a longer cast time since it would be hard to move and cast.

    That way you can still run around casting but need to be real carefull as you will suffer massive MP problems as well as longer cast times allowing the enemy more time to stop you casting the spell with a stun/silence.
    Death is great people are dying to get there.

    Death is great it's the cure to Life.

  5. #5
    Ascendant Hanlo's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Nightmares
    Posts
    2,729

    Default

    I enjoyed VG's casting. It made sense that you could cast at walking speed. It only really allowed for one more cast (maybe) if you walked straight back while nuking, but it was good nonetheless.

    Want a Melee Mage? Support the Theurgist!

  6. #6
    Plane Touched kartys's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    263

    Default

    My preferred method to handling casting is to able to to move but reduced movement speed. I don't think it would be a good idea to increase mp cost because you would have to take into consideration when the mp is drained.

    If it is at the start of the spell than you can be standing still and start the cast than be free to move around negating extra mp costs. Same for if it is drained at the end of the spell - you can move but right before you finish casting stop and again no negative effects. Of course with short cast time spell this would be hard to time.

    The one way I think it would work is if it were a buff you applied to yourself that any spell cast under that buff had extra mp cost but you could move with interrupting.

    I myself again would prefer just reduced movement speed (similar to Vanguard). Gives you a little more room to function as a caster. Of course channeled spells would be ones that you have to stay still for though.

  7. #7
    Official Rift Founding Fan Site Operator Arithion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Kansas, USA
    Posts
    1,048

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hanlo View Post
    I enjoyed VG's casting. It made sense that you could cast at walking speed. It only really allowed for one more cast (maybe) if you walked straight back while nuking, but it was good nonetheless.
    ^ This.

    This would be my preferred casting method as well. Currently dabbling a little in DDO while I wait for 2011 *sighs* and the reduced speed walking while casting in that game feels like a good balance.
    The Rift Podcast Site

    Telarapedia | RiftIRC
    Level 50 Bahmi Warrior - Greybriar - Primal

  8. #8
    Ascendant Kalbuir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Amsterdam
    Posts
    2,265

    Default

    I also hope they take the walking speed while casting appraoch, but wouldn't mind it if you had to be stationairy for some abilities. However having an interrupt on every cast where you move I would rather not see. It is not about beeing able to run at full speed or move around consantly.

    For me its about beeing able to readjust my range to allies and enemies without giving up the ability to cast a heal. DPS / Tanks / Enemies are always moving and at times its so easy if a healer can take a few quick steps here and there to stay in range or keep his group all in his current range.

    Regards.
    Kalbuir

  9. #9
    Rift Disciple TemetNosce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    148

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Arithion View Post
    ^ This.

    This would be my preferred casting method as well. Currently dabbling a little in DDO while I wait for 2011 *sighs* and the reduced speed walking while casting in that game feels like a good balance.
    I really enjoyed DDO's take on combat in general. It felt a lot more active and involved than most MMOs. Although spellcasting broke down at higher levels (ironically unlike D&D it was best in mid levels). Still, I agree they managed to do good work with spells and wouldn't mind Rift adopting a similar approach.
    Ipsa scientia potestas est

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts