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Thread: Hybrids vs Pure

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    Soulwalker Gwaehir's Avatar
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    Default Hybrids vs Pure

    Based on what Im seeing on the class calculators as far as what powers and abilities are available to the classes, I trying to figure out if it truly is worthwhile to hybridize in this game.

    The point sink based on the 51 points avaialble seems best used to sepc in your main class. Otherwise, the secondary and tertiary class additions become analagous to disciplines ala Shadowbane. The amount of points needed to make a 2nd and 3rd class viable are vast IMO to open many of the viable powers.

    Any thougths on this?
    Last edited by Gwaehir; 10-22-2010 at 11:23 AM.

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    Soulwalker
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    The game is only in Alpha, and a lot of the spells/abilities that have been shown have already been changed, and will continue to change through beta up until release, I believe. I've gone back and forth between both sides of the argument--with what is shown know, certainly if you want to maximize your worth in a party/raid situation, the 51 point abilities seem amazing and well-worth investing all of your points into. That being said, however, spending points in other branches allow for a lot broader of a play experience, especially from a solo oriented build. Some of the classes have an amazing deal of synergy through that would allow multiple soul specs to actually be strong, but for the most part, in what is currently known about the game, there are a lot of classes that don't seem to have synergy at all. I think that'll change, especially as developers start being able to determine whether or not people are going to be viable with tri-soul point allotments in their specs.

    The concept is so core to what they're trying to sell about the game that I think, in the end, there'll be merit to building a spec split between three souls that are available. Even if the base abilities you receive aren't as powerful with only being able to spend 10-21 points, I have faith that they'll find a reason for you to do just that. I like the concept, I do. I like being able to see every class inside of the cleric archetype without having to level up 8 different characters. I like that I'll be able to adjust what's needed on the fly, if an event has more AOE damage to the group or I need stronger single-target heals. There's a lot left to be changed inside of the game, and the Trion folks seem to be doing a good job.

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    Champion Helspyre's Avatar
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    Valid point. A good example of this is the Ranger pets. If I want to dabble in that soul to get a pet I'd have to go at least 20 points into it to summon something that doesn't cap out at level 23 (useless at max level).

    I honestly don't see myself using three souls unless it's for some really special situation. I'll be going mostly into one tree and a little into another to compliment my first soul. If I do go into a third it will be for like 0-5 points or something.
    Last edited by Helspyre; 10-22-2010 at 12:14 PM.
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    Plane Touched Ware's Avatar
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    One thing to remember is that you only need to spend 31 points to get the top level ability in any tree (30 points to unlock that last tier and one point for the ability). That leaves 20 points for other souls. I also imagine that maxing every ability in a particular tree won't make sense for most builds anyway as not every ability is suited to every play style. There are enough attractive low-point abilities that I think 31-10-10 or 31-20-0 builds being much more common than 51-0-0 builds. (Purifier is a perfect example of this - for 10 points you get a damage shield, rez, cure disease, +5% wisdom, and +5% armor buff after casting a heal.)
    Last edited by Ware; 10-22-2010 at 12:24 PM.

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    Champion of Telara Selene's Avatar
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    Honestly, there's been enough back and forth in this forum that I think both will be viable. A while back, people were talking about pures would be the best, then it was no! hybrids will be amazing, etc. A lot of the trees have some pretty nifty talents low in the tree. A lot of the builds people are coming up with involve 2 or 3 souls, too.

  6. #6
    Telaran Egdiod's Avatar
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    i for one am going to try all different builds from the 51-0-0's and the 31-10-10's to everything in between.

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    Champion of Telara Selene's Avatar
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    Me too - well, at least one of my builds will be for experimentation purposes. I might have to make multiple chars per calling if I find a few builds I like early on though.

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    Rift Disciple Banditman's Avatar
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    So far, most of the builds I have played with have been 26/25 . . . 26/20/5, that sort of thing. 26 being the "magic number" for one of the root abilities. I haven't seen very many 31 point abilities that really look strong enough to take. One of the cleric classes has a 31 point in combat rez, Purifier or Justicar I think. Other than that, meh.

    Mostly, it seems like I find myself looking for synergies in the lower levels of alternate souls that I can apply to my "main" soul. For instance, an Elementalist isn't really much of a caster himself, relying mostly on his pets. However, some of the lower level Pyromancer things fit in very well with what an Elementalist does. Similar synergies exist between Shaman and Justicar.

    I am fairly concerned that pure souls simply won't be strong enough. I think the root abilities are sort of "backwards", in that they get fewer and farther between as you travel further down the root. I would really like to see the root abilities become more numerous and closer together as you travel farther, as that would more strongly incentivize a pure soul.

  9. #9
    Sword of Telara CyclopsSlayer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ware View Post
    One thing to remember is that you only need to spend 31 points to get the top level ability in any tree (30 points to unlock that last tier and one point for the ability). That leaves 20 points for other souls. I also imagine that maxing every ability in a particular tree won't make sense for most builds anyway as not every ability is suited to every play style. There are enough attractive low-point abilities that I think 31-10-10 or 31-20-0 builds being much more common than 51-0-0 builds. (Purifier is a perfect example of this - for 10 points you get a damage shield, rez, cure disease, +5% wisdom, and +5% armor buff after casting a heal.)
    But don't forget the Root abilities.
    Take the Purifier, with 44 points you get a reactive absorption shield, while the 51 point talent doesn't seem of more than niche use, the 44 I would see as almost a raid 'must'.

  10. #10
    Rift Disciple Garmr's Avatar
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    I'll be starting a sentinel, picking up a shaman soul when I can and than doing 1 pure sent 1 pure shm and 1 hybrid of the 2.











    All of the above will change 1 year from now and I seriously haven't a clue what I'll be playing or in what build!

    It's almost TO MANY ways to build a toon in Rift.

  11. #11
    Telaran AhkoRevari's Avatar
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    I love the idea of making a million different types of hybrids. however what I think its going to come down to is raids and groups. raids are most likely almost always going to demand cookie cutter pure builds, where as most groups are small enough that specialized players fit better into more situations.

    Group Benefit > High DPS.
    Last edited by AhkoRevari; 10-22-2010 at 04:07 PM.

  12. #12
    Rift Disciple Azimov's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gwaehir View Post
    Based on what Im seeing on the class calculators as far as what powers and abilities are available to the classes, I trying to figure out if it truly is worthwhile to hybridize in this game.
    I didnt even know there were class builders yet!
    How many are out there? I see one linked on first page.

  13. #13
    Rift Disciple Magnetar's Avatar
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    It really is too early to say but my feeling based on the Alpha Soul trees is that it is really going to depend on the souls. Some pure classes will not be ideal for certain roles. The souls which have mix of PVE and PVP talents don't seem to be designed to be the best at both PVE and PVP and will benefit much more from being a hybrid. They will probably work well enough in solo PVE but won't be ideal for end game PVE or PVP but this is OK. Finding different combination's that work well together for specific situations will hopefully be part of the fun of experimenting and will allow some truly exciting combination's.

    The X Factor though is what the end game content will be like. There very well may be encounters in which some talents that we consider to be "PVP" could be very useful in end game PVE which could potentially make any tree viable for certain situations.

    I am looking forward to experimenting with the different classes to find something that is unique and fun and it would be a very nice change to not have to worry about min/max so I am cautiously optimistic that this will be the case.

  14. #14
    Soulwalker Epicurus's Avatar
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    I look forward to this aspect of the game and I believe it is going to be a crucial utility. I look forward to changing my souls based on what I am doing and who I am doing it something that can’t be done in other games.
    Last edited by Epicurus; 10-23-2010 at 01:36 AM.

  15. #15
    Ascendant Oggiefishier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epicurus View Post
    I look forward to this aspect of the game and I believe it is going to be a crucial utility. I look forward to changing my souls based on what I am doing and who I am doing it something that canít be done in other games.
    personally i see hybrid souls being the better way from what info we have.. however hybrid role toons i dont see being worth it. get too scattered in what you want your toon to do and it wont be good at any of it. aka trying to heal tank and dps in one toon wont be as effective as taking all the dps talents out of 3 trees that work well together or 3 sets of tanking abilities or all the healing abilities..
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