+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 39
Like Tree10Likes

Thread: Rogue ranged specs VS. Other classes and their ranged specs

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    19

    Default Rogue ranged specs VS. Other classes and their ranged specs

    Hi, I know i have brought up this issue before but participating in more and more raids has reaffirmed my beliefs even more. I have every class and have pretty much tried all specs and variations of them. Compared to other classes, the rogue ranged specs have much lower DPS, especially the marksman. I know that quite a while back it was way too overpowered and that's why it was reduced. However, it was reduced too much and now all the other classes (warrior, mage, cleric) have higher ranged DPS spec. Also, now that the bard souls was buffed, with good gear it pulls even higher than the marksman. And that I find ironic because bard is supposed to be a support soul and it pulls higher DPS then the actual DPS soul. Fellow telarans please back me up on this.
    Thank you for reading and taking this into consideration.

  2. #2
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    72

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    Hi, I know i have brought up this issue before but participating in more and more raids has reaffirmed my beliefs even more. I have every class and have pretty much tried all specs and variations of them. Compared to other classes, the rogue ranged specs have much lower DPS, especially the marksman. I know that quite a while back it was way too overpowered and that's why it was reduced. However, it was reduced too much and now all the other classes (warrior, mage, cleric) have higher ranged DPS spec. Also, now that the bard souls was buffed, with good gear it pulls even higher than the marksman. And that I find ironic because bard is supposed to be a support soul and it pulls higher DPS then the actual DPS soul. Fellow telarans please back me up on this.
    Thank you for reading and taking this into consideration.


    Back you up .. YOU ARE SPOT ON.
    Even newbies realize this in no time, I was a newbie when in PvP I realized this. The argument is hey ranged should NOT have good DPS, AND Inq, Cabalists, Mage's are? I play Inq too and yet I have seen Inq's complain Inq don't have enough DPS. Well try play MM, compare DPS to MMs. I mean its just appalling, and Bard's having more DPS come on!

    My interest in MM is for PvP, only other option for Rogue's is said to be Assassin. One I like playing Bladedancer, 2nd Assassins don't seem very competent in group PvP. But to waste such a brilliant well balanced soul merely due to lower DPS its just mind boggling. It is well balanced soul, with good skills, it requires skill to play. Why it has NO potential because it lacks DPS. It has one of the lowest DPS in the game. It just doesn't make sense.

    DPS wise MMs should be on par with Inq. OTHER RANGED SPECS ALSO HAVE GOOD DPS. So the argument MMs are ranged and should not have good DPS is just flawed. MMs lacking in DPS is just waste of brilliant gameplay. A soul with a lot of potential, and with good DPS will become one of the most played souls.

  3. #3
    Prophet of Telara Fiskerton's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    1,120

    Default

    Ranger is pretty on par with other callings' dps specs.

    The problem with buffing mm becomes this: if we buff mm, with all its utility, what will happen to ranger? Inq and tempest do not have direct competitors and mage ranged specs are in the same position as marksman. It needs a reason to exist other than others are better than it. We already have ranger as our competitive ranged spec.
    ~ | Fiskerton | Fiskermage | Fiskerheals | Fiskerbear | ~

    I'm a homeless stray of a raider

  4. #4
    RIFT Guide Writer
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    2,257

    Default

    Except Ranger kind of ****s all over other range specs since its last round of changes, besides Tempest.
    Last edited by evantide; 05-09-2014 at 09:13 AM.
    Meciel - Mage - Defer Death - Greybriar
    12/12 T1, 14/15 T2, 1/9 T3

  5. #5
    Ascendant
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    1,724

    Default

    As far as separate identities go I'd almost suggest giving Marksman a spot of improved ranged cleaving whilst leaving Ranger as a 100% specialized ST ranged spec. Of course then you're at risk at treading on Sab's and Tact's toes (the latter of which is In need of some attention of it's own eventually).

    For now though it's probably best to wait till we see these Ranger changes Vladd's been brainstorming (hint, hint!).

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    Except Ranger kind of ****s all over other range specs, besides Tempest.
    Do not discount Warlock. It's cleaving capabilities absolutely annihilate anything the Ranger is capable of and should not be disregarded (and before anyone says anything, no I am not saying "Nerf Warlock" kindly put down the torches and pitchforks, please!).
    Last edited by Kedon; 05-09-2014 at 09:14 AM.

  6. #6
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    72

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiskerton View Post
    Ranger is pretty on par with other callings' dps specs.
    .
    Ranger sucks in PvP.
    Hence Rogues having to play MM. Other souls have utilities too, Cabalists have a lot of utilities can be played as AoE or ST, great at crowd control with its utilities. While MM will solely well mostly remain ST DPS.

  7. #7
    Rift Master Nasacrim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    658

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    Also, now that the bard souls was buffed, with good gear it pulls even higher than the marksman. And that I find ironic because bard is supposed to be a support soul and it pulls higher DPS then the actual DPS soul.
    This is incorrect. MM is 5k ahead in dps vs bard, after the buffs.
    Also, ranger is a extremly competitive spec now, making rogues ranged dps viable.

    The low dps from MM is an issue and is supposed to be adressed.

    Regarding PvP, MM is fine. Good MM's will tell you that.
    Last edited by Nasacrim; 05-09-2014 at 09:52 AM.

  8. #8
    Champion
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    590

    Default

    MM is one of my favorite spec's in PVP. Simple rotation, good dmg, and ton's of utility all the while being highly mobile.

  9. #9
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Posts
    20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    Compared to other classes, the rogue ranged specs have much lower DPS,
    This is not true (in PVE) the Ranger is higher than mage, and cleric but do the same dps as warrior.

    why ? Because vladd LOVEEEES crit. He based war spec and rogue spec all about CRITS

    for exemple : if the war didn't crit in his burst it's over for him he won't reach the top DPS.

    All the dammage of the ranger is based on twin shot.

    Those 2 crit based soul do a RANDOM dps. i saw this one day :

    2 ranger Me and a friend (both the same stuff)
    Same amount of crit on the boss
    but i was 6K dps higher than him, and he was 2k better than me on the previous fight.

    why ? because of the crit of twin shot. i got like 57% crit he got 34% but he crits more on the others spells. The ranger spec is a ONE skills based. the warrior is pretty close because it works the same way on his burst if he crit he will be the TOP DPS. if not he'll suck.

    both do to much dammage on spécific skills.
    if you got high CC and CP you'll get a very high dps on the ranger.



    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    especially the marksman.
    The MM is just useless in PVE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    Also, now that the bard souls was buffed,
    this is true but the oracle still do 10k more than bard for the same "support"

  10. #10
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Posts
    56

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfail View Post



    The MM is just useless in PVE.



    this is true but the oracle still do 10k more than bard for the same "support"
    The MM Purge is useful, and fights with lots of target swaps, like Kyzan (Purge), Eggtenders (Target Swap).

    And.. I don't think Oracle is going to do 10k more than a good bard. A bad bard probably (possible?).. I've seen Bards knocking on 13-14k DPS. I'm positive Oracles don't do 24k DPS

  11. #11
    Rift Master Nasacrim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    658

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfail View Post
    This is not true (in PVE) the Ranger is higher than mage, and cleric but do the same dps as warrior.
    Its not higher than warlock.

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfail View Post
    ...but the oracle still do 10k more than bard for the same "support"
    This is incorrect.

    Also, dps is damage over time. You dont get a few lucky crits on twinshot and call that dps. Ofc that in short fights it will deal inconsistent damage due to rng.

    The soul doesnt do "random" dps, it has a steady and fixed value after the crit chance has stabilized around the value you got on your stats.

    Ofc, in short fights, it will deal inconsistent damage due to rng.

  12. #12
    Soulwalker
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    19

    Default Bard higher than Marksman

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasacrim View Post
    This is incorrect. MM is 5k ahead in dps vs bard, after the buffs.
    Also, ranger is a extremly competitive spec now, making rogues ranged dps viable.

    The low dps from MM is an issue and is supposed to be adressed.

    Regarding PvP, MM is fine. Good MM's will tell you that.
    Well actually I have seen a bard being able to pull a constant 17k and on other occasions 13k. The only chance marksman has of pulling even close to that high is being really well geared or having both the pyrochon and bard buffs and boosts applied. I am a constant witness of that fact. Yes, marksman is fine in PVP but it is definately not fine in PVE.
    Last edited by Lillyblossom; 05-21-2014 at 09:52 AM.

  13. #13
    Rift Master Nasacrim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    658

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lillyblossom View Post
    Well actually I have seen a bard being able to pull a constant 17k and on other occasions 13k.
    -.-

    A bard and a MM, equally geared. The bard will NEVER, in any circunstance go ahead of a MM.
    A MM easily pulls 17k, im doing 20k on MM.
    Last edited by Nasacrim; 05-22-2014 at 05:13 AM.

  14. #14
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiskerton View Post
    Ranger is pretty on par with other callings' dps specs.

    The problem with buffing mm becomes this: if we buff mm, with all its utility, what will happen to ranger? Inq and tempest do not have direct competitors and mage ranged specs are in the same position as marksman. It needs a reason to exist other than others are better than it. We already have ranger as our competitive ranged spec.
    First who gives a flying fudge. Ranger is on par with Inquis.. tempest and Warlock >. We should first worry about how we stack up to other callings and half the reason rogues are in the state they are is because the devs address people crying about internal issues and miss the external.

    Second what added utility? The purge? Both Interrupts are just about on par now. If you are going to say Utility holds a soul back then it needs to be done as a Utility/Support soul. Saying a DPS soul should do the same or less than an actual SUPPORT soul because it has a purge beggars logic and the imagination.

    In essence you should look at other souls. Inquis brings the same (if not more) utility than MM yet matches ranger. People need to stop focusing on MM v Ranger, NB v BD v Sin etc and focus on what the game was designed around. Cleric v Warrior v Rogue v Mage. So long as we go with these internal battles we are cutting our own damn throats. Want to identify with a soul/class? Plenty of games out there... to quote my favorite sig on these forums "you can play WoW in Rift but you don't have to."
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  15. #15
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Nasacrim View Post
    -.-

    A bard and a MM, equally geared. The bard will NEVER, in any circunstance go ahead of a MM.
    A MM easily pulls 17k, im doing 20k on MM.
    You can come stupidly close if you swap the build from the standard to the Sin/rng sub souls and go crit power gear. Your hps suffers but your dps gets significant boosts. 20k no... that 17 k? absolutely.

    This is actually my big complaint about oracle. Even without doing something that crazy its dps is good (still better than bard even with the bard buff ) and jeebus due to the shield mechanic it blows away bard parses with little effort. Plus it's debuffs auto spread to mobs that come into the radius AND it has a cure... don't get me started....ugggh. So really comparing it to Bard is kinda silly. Bard is dead. Compare it to oracle. ~= dps... 7k hps for a t2 READY Oracle. Yeah makes sense. And why is MM in that state? Because of the stupid and senseless internal pissing match.
    Last edited by Galibier; 05-22-2014 at 06:50 AM.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts