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Thread: Pure Animal Tamer Class

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple
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    Default Pure Animal Tamer Class

    This's something I started in another thread, but found the class thread and thought I should clean it up a little and repost here. I've also tried to clean up my thought a lot but keep the meat of the topic...

    Something I've always wanted to see is an extremely robust pet system where the pet is a fully integrated character.

    I know you have to stick to some fundamentals like it can't out level you, and you can't keep changing its name. But I've never understood why the Pokemon model hasn't been modified then applied to other games, especially MMOG's. 450'ish pets, mix/match skills, highly customizable. Ultima Online also has a robust pet system, trainable stats and skills, 20+ unique high-end tamables. WoW it's been tacked on since day one, but it is slowly improving with each expansion.

    The pet functionality of every mmog always seems to be tacked on like an after thought. "oh you can't tame THAT." Well why not, it is an animal? Then WoW later says, oh you can tame more things, but only if you put all your points into taming. Uh I'm already a hunter, and now you want me to put points into beast mastery, animal lore, whatever because all of the cool pets are now only tamable by beast masters or by even higher taming. How come your level isn't good enough?

    And factoring in the pets damage in your overall DPS? I think that's so messed up, because all someone has to do is outsmart your pet's AI and you lose 30% of your damage. This was the same in Ultima Online. You had to put 120 points into taming, lore, vet to get an animal with only a few attacks. Although in UO you could get one, extremely powerful dragon. It was balanced because it left you fairly weak, but the AI was just awful and dragons don't behave anyway! It's worse in WoW unless you're beast specced in which case dps is more like 40% in your pet's favor and if it gets out smarted (Which doesn't take much) you're even worse off. In Pokemon, damage is 100% pet-based. The closest you can get is UO with a dragon that takes 5/5 of your 'pet slots' which means you can't so much as mount (although they later made a mountable 5/5 dragon.) Which means if your dragon dies you're dead if the mob agros you before you can hide... Maybe that should be how it is, but then you need a more robust pet system than UO for controlling your pet. As pets get lower and lower in health they get weaker and misbehave even more...

    Any thoughts for or against a pure tamer class after Ranger?
    Last edited by WaterPaladin; 09-06-2010 at 04:00 PM.

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple fangGWJ's Avatar
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    There is alway the beastmaster in the warrior calling.

    From what I've seen of the ranger it looks like pet classes could be a throw back to EQ, which would be disappointing.

    We really don't need pets that summon at a lower level than your character, have a max level, and needing to buy a new pet summoning spell that will last for the next 10 levels, or so. I was so glad when WoW's hunter class got rid of all of that.

    I am hoping that this is just the way it works for the ranger and not for the druid, elementalist and beast master. From the videos I have seen, the elementalist's pet does stay the same level as your character at least up to level 5...

    I am also hoping I am wrong about the ranger. I am hoping that the low level summons have spell ranks so that they can be leveled up to 50. And that the higher level summons will have better stats and a greater variety of abilities. IE the lesser dire wolf only has a basic attack, but the dire wolf has a special attack, and the greater dire wolf has more special attacks and a self buff or berserk like ability or maybe even a simple combo point system.

  3. #3
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    Nods. I was talking to them about that @ Pax that pets bare minimum need to be personalizable.....

    They need names, unique looks, independant leveling, good AI (based on what animal they are) etc.

    Well you know. WoW's hunter class wasn't the worst possible, it just was nowhere near being optimum. Even in Diablo 2 they eventually patched it in so the mercenaries were a pretty darn customizable 'pet' which was an extremely welcome addition. I think SW:TOR is having customizable 'apprentices' also.

    So in WoW you have Warlocks, Death Knights, then to a lesser extent almost every other race. By Cataclysm almost every race is getting a summoned pet. Yawn!

    But still even warlocks and DK's are basically summoned pets, so frustrating. Warlocks are stuck with whatever stupid name is generated, DK's pets are randomized every 2 seconds they respawn.

    Then in UO you had animal tamers and tinkerers. Tinkerer's could make these wonderful huge golems but there was next to zero customizability. But they were extremely unique from the rest of the tamables...

    All of the different pets for animal tamers in UO were completely just reskined. But you could 'animal lore' them and you'd find out that their stats varied by a TON. The problem is 80% of the pets in the game were below stat cap, 125. Then anything above stat cap was completely stat locked. But its skills could still be raised.

    Too bad raising their skills took an eternity and when they died they lost quite a bit of skill until they toned down skill loss.

    However again what they may have lacked in looking different, their stats were always a nice huge range if they were above stat cap. Also their skills could be quite different. 80% of the skills were the same, but some had poisoning, some had magery, some had 'pack instinct' it was a whole deal.

    So anyway I could write novels on what I think a pet class should be. But definitely should stick with melee + pet not caster or ranged + pet. So annoying.

    Anyway I think in Rift a melee ranger is viable, so I'm a happy camper.

    Thanks for the nice post!
    Last edited by WaterPaladin; 09-05-2010 at 02:41 PM.

  4. #4
    Telaran Bamfy's Avatar
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    Default Pets

    I do like pet classes that have more control of their pets also the ability to call on new pets for whatever fight your engaging in. I do like the idea of the pet gaining exp, and growing with you, also gaining new abilities. There needs to be a good balance with the pet clases though, they can become OP very easily. I have always played the healer in MMO's, (except wow, i have a lock also) . I would love to really get into a pet class with a good balance and control of the pet.

  5. #5
    Champion Myrdynn's Avatar
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    not really into the whole pokemon thing, kinda of was repetetive in your post, but what I always wanted was a pet that I could level invest stats too and get geared up
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  6. #6
    Rift Disciple fangGWJ's Avatar
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    Another one of my favorite pet classes was the theurgist from daoc. It was a class that was designed to pet spam.

    It had temporary (~10-15 sec duration) pets of different elements with different abilities. (air pets had a short stun and did melee damage, ice pets did more damage at range and snared, earth pets were sturdier and did melee damage)

    The great thing about this class was that it was GREAT in groups. (unlike many other pet classes that shine soloing) You could send a pet or two to each of your groupmates to help them "solo" mobs that they chain pull. So if you were in a group of 5, they could pull 5 or more mobs (2 for every tank) and you would send a couple of pets to each and watch the xp fly.

    I hope the beast master (or the rumored necromancer) is like this with a mix of temporary situational pets and a permanent pet.

  7. #7
    Plane Walker Fayde's Avatar
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    To be fair some things should not be tameable.

    Tigers and such yes you can tame them but some thing like a Dragon **** no thats just been silly.

    I think some of the rare and most powerfull animals should not be tameable IE Dragons as that is just abit silly.

    Still i thik we should have some rare types we can tame that might have a special skill pass or active that give it a slight edge of the same type.

    IE

    Normal Tiger has a claw attack bite attack and thats it.

    Deathless Tiger might have the same skills but a passive damage boost nothing big but a boost form been around the death plane magic abit to long.


    I all so think the Pets should some what control there own skills and not force the player to have to tell his pet to do each and every attack but at the same time be able to control some skills IE Stuns and maybe snare like attacks.

    I would not mind to see a BST form FF11 effect you had pets you could summon for a short time to help when there was nothing around that was able to be used as a pet like in an area of just undead mobs.
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  8. #8
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    UO has tamable dragons left and right, just one thing. They're insanely difficult to tame and they disobey no matter how high your taming is, even if it is maxed.

    In WoW they don't have tamable dragons, but instead what they did was make tons of dif things that look very similar, Warp Stalkers, Wind Serpents, Chimerae... You can't tame basilisks I think, but you can tame alligators which is just a reskin of a basilisk.

    So anyway yeah.

    Sorry about the Pokemon stuff being repetitive in my first post. I'll try to clean it up a bit.

    Also I love the idea of animals being able to wear modified gear. In UO you could get 'barding' for your swamp dragon mount that made him look metal. It was SO COOL!!!!!! It gave you an armor bonus while riding him but could be busted off, always requiring you to buy more, but it was awesome never the less. In WoW, mount armor was cosmetic but still made a huge impact when you looked at it.

    I also thought if your animal has claws, you should be able to buy claw extenders, for horses, horse shoes, horse barding, studded collars for cats.... I could go on all day with cool armor, mods for animals,.

    I've also been a firm believer that animals should be able to help you with your profession, example a fire breathing pet helping you build a camp fire, bear helping you fish, dog helping you fetch, giant moles helping you mine....
    Last edited by WaterPaladin; 09-06-2010 at 04:01 PM.

  9. #9
    Rift Disciple fangGWJ's Avatar
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    I have to admit I always did get a kick out of riding around on my pet llama in UO =P

  10. #10
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    It's too complicated and it's too much.

    "Keeping it simple is how complexity works best."

  11. #11
    Champion of Telara Zikkar's Avatar
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    No classes in WoW that dont have a pet now are getting one. Only classes that have pets now have a summonable combat pet in Cata.

    -Soon A developer term that is never as "soon" as you want it to be.

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