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Thread: Only 51 points, am I reading this correctly?

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple forestwhitakereye's Avatar
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    Default Only 51 points, am I reading this correctly?

    According to http://forums.riftgame.com/showthrea...ded#ig_classes, it seems to me, if I'm reading it correctly, that at max level a person would have 51 points to spend among their three trees. But according to the sample picture referenced in the link, it looks like the last skill obtainable from a tree is 51.

    Am I correct in saying that if you reach the last skill in a tree, you have no points left to go to any other tree?

    I know it says it's pending, but I'm sorry, this doesn't make any sense to me, having come from playing WoW where you have 71 points to spend in trees that go to 51. You speak of nearly unlimited flexibility, but the number of points is an incredibly restricting factor.

    Personally, I'd allow people to access 4-5 trees and give them 101 points to spend. Make the mobs harder to compensate. People will eat up that kind of freedom.

    Come on, devs. The flexibility is a major selling point, don't lock people into just one tree maxxed while they have up to 7 more to choose from.

  2. #2
    Champion of Telara g0kuenuan's Avatar
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    thats the fun of it, you can be PURE class or make a combo that you want with those 51 points
    http://forums.riftgame.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=1282&dateline=1279040  725

  3. #3
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    Breaking established mechanics isn't a good idea.

    In a Necromancer class breakdown I did, one mechanic I suggested was to only be able to get 5 undead minions in the native soul tree of that class; and that that would induce a closure of the other soul trees.

    Pure class soul trees should give something in return for not being flexible or dynamic.

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple
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    It does seem a pity, as having just a little more points would be nice, but 51 it is.

    On the other hand, maybe there won't be any need to get the level 51 skill, if it is not overpowered, compared tho the others.

  5. #5
    Shadowlander
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    Considering you'll be able to swap out builds, I don't see a problem. There should be a sacrifice of some sort, in this case the skills / abilities of the other trees, in order to gain the (hopefully) powerful skill that comes from devoting all your points into one clas.

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    Rift Disciple Adjana's Avatar
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    To support multiclassing i'd also prefer to have either more than 51 points at the end or to get the last root ability from a soul with less than 51 points.

    If the last root ability is to strong (we still have to see the balance) you are kind of forced to get it and this leaves no room for picking a 2nd or even a 3rd soul. I know some people don't like to multiclass and they should still have the possibility to spend all of their points into one soultree to get the most of it. Others who want to multiclass should be able to get all abilities of their primary soul and also be able to get a few things from others. But in this case, they should have to choose which abilities of their souls are improved (or added) by spending points in the tree without pushing everything.

    Every soul has 16 root abilities at the moment. With getting one every two levels and some bigger gaps for the last ones we could get all of them between level 35 or 45. Then we still had 5 to 15 points to pick some minor things from other souls which would hopefully lead to more variety.
    Adjana - Shadows of the Dragon

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    Rift Disciple Nimsul's Avatar
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    I have to say that'ss disappointing to say the least, Especially if you have your heart set on a class you plan to take to the top.

    There needs to be AT LEAST enough points to take 1 soul to the top with enough points left over to add some flavor for another selection. Otherwise they're just shooting themselves in the foot and are removing all this "Amazing customization" they keep trying to promote.

  8. #8
    Shadowlander Qualan's Avatar
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    i don't see the problem. Limiting points at lauch is nto a bad thing- With expansions/time, i have no doubt this will be increased anyway.

    The fact that you can't chose all options - have to leave some gaps seems to annoy some people to no end but you can't have it all. Having it all would mean no choices but also less diversity

    and if spending points in another tree means no pure filled tree in main class, well than that is the price to pay and up to the player to decide if it is worth it.

    Anyway- my experience is that beside level increases, you also can get increases in alternate advancement- which the different trees would allow - with tha passing of time so it will work out anyway

  9. #9
    Prophet of Telara Ravenwolf's Avatar
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    I don't understand where the problem is? Trion have said from the very beginning that the point of the class system in RIFT is so you can CHOOSE your class or CHOOSE to make a new one....
    So you can either be full one class, or combine classes to make a unique class to your play style.
    If they were to allow you to go fully in one class and then let you put a tonne of points in other classes you would overpowered and unbalanced I believe.
    Think of it like this...

    Going 51 points into First soul = 100 %
    Going 26 into First Soul and 25 into Second soul = 100 %
    Going 17 into First Soul 17 in Second and 17 in Third Soul = 100 %

    These are the basic options (give or take some points from one soul into others)
    These are balanced in power. Because you have to make a trade off.
    You either have a small amount of End-of-class spells and abilities, OR you get a wide variety of beginning & mid-of-class spells and abilities.

    This style of class system further prevents the creation of "optimal" classes/"specs" for a certain calling because one player will have something someone else doesn't, and that other person has something the first does not.

    However we may need to agree to disagree as it is a play style preference and everyone has their individual preferences.

  10. #10
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    Until we've seen the trees in action and experimented fully with them saying "WAAAAAAAH it's not like wow which is easy to make a build" comes across as childish.

    Personally I like the idea, you make a full class and get the best root abilities but be restricted which which branch abilities you can get. Or you can maximise your branch talents picking and choosing the best of those and not getting the best abilities from the root of the tree.

    Which is better? I'm sure different people will have different ideas about that.

  11. #11
    Rift Disciple Nimsul's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ravenwolf View Post
    I don't understand where the problem is? Trion have said from the very beginning that the point of the class system in RIFT is so you can CHOOSE your class or CHOOSE to make a new one....
    So you can either be full one class, or combine classes to make a unique class to your play style.
    If they were to allow you to go fully in one class and then let you put a tonne of points in other classes you would overpowered and unbalanced I believe.
    Think of it like this...

    Going 51 points into First soul = 100 %
    Going 26 into First Soul and 25 into Second soul = 100 %
    Going 17 into First Soul 17 in Second and 17 in Third Soul = 100 %

    These are the basic options (give or take some points from one soul into others)
    These are balanced in power. Because you have to make a trade off.
    You either have a small amount of End-of-class spells and abilities, OR you get a wide variety of beginning & mid-of-class spells and abilities.

    This style of class system further prevents the creation of "optimal" classes/"specs" for a certain calling because one player will have something someone else doesn't, and that other person has something the first does not.

    However we may need to agree to disagree as it is a play style preference and everyone has their individual preferences.

    Hmmm, you make a valid point. However, with the promotion of the multi-classing, would there be a benefit to going all the way up a tree? I guess we'll have to wait and see.

  12. #12
    Prophet of Telara Ravenwolf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nimsul View Post
    Hmmm, you make a valid point. However, with the promotion of the multi-classing, would there be a benefit to going all the way up a tree? I guess we'll have to wait and see.
    I'm assuming the end tree skills are either really cool, have good usefulness, possibly high dmg?
    If they were, for example, higher damage or healing than lower spells & abilities.
    However taking these skills could, for example, debilitate you in terms of survivability that you gain through skills in other classes.
    That is one more simple example of a trade off that could or could not be in the class system.
    Not having played the game I do not know for sure these are just based off assumptions and observations.

  13. #13
    Soulwalker Torkill's Avatar
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    51 points makes total sense to me. When multiclassing, you give up the ability to obtain the highest level skills from either class. Only by focusing all of your training in to one and only one class could you ever master the abiities provided at max level. The point of multiclassing is giving up being the best <class> in order to have a broader, more versatile range of abilities. And you certainly do not multiclass in order to be a maxed out <class> PLUS skills from another class. And 101 points... now you want to combine 1 max class with another just 1 point shy of max?!! Just because WoW wants to go ahead and cater to the mentality of a 13-yr old of I deserve everything, doesn't mean that other games should.

    To hear is to forget, to see is to remember, to do is to understand.

  14. #14
    Shadowlander Agahnim's Avatar
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    Yeah, the 51 points is enough. It's either specc one class fully, or be a jack of all trades, master of none.

    It's like DnD, if you multiclass, say a Wizard, you will lose out on 9th lvl spells, and going lower for every other class lvl you pick that isn't Wizard.

  15. #15
    Rift Disciple
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    I'm not sure how you did not understand this until now. No one, of any importance, has said you will be able to master more than 1 class. It also makes total sense to give you exactly what you need to max out 1 class and then allow you to choose how you want to spend those points.

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