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Thread: Healing in PVP should have diminishing returns

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    Plane Walker bear_on_the_job's Avatar
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    Default Healing in PVP should have diminishing returns

    Right now I feel there are 2 overshadowing issues in PVP that frustrate a lot of people - 1-shots and infinite healing. 1/2/3-shots are for a different discussion. I play both a 50 War and 50 Cleric in PVP, so I have experience on both sides of the fence, from a class with no healing at all, to a class that can tank 4-5 players and walk away from it.

    My proposition is that each time a player receives healing for more than 10% of their max HP, they get a debuff that reduces healing on them by ~10% for the next 5 seconds, up to 5 stacks max. This would not stack with other healing reductions like Lingering Wounds, so you would never go over 50% reduction. This would also be based off the players HP pool, not just triggered from every little heal they receive, so Chloros/Justicars don't stack DR on every just from spam.

    The way this is helpful is it still allows healers to rescue people in clutch situations, and even sustain them for a reasonable amount of time in a fight. But for the situation where a single healing cleric is tanking 4-5 players and not breaking a sweat...it makes them weigh their options a little more.

    The values listed above could be adjusted, or even the mechanic. But I feel there needs to be something in place that makes healing less effective on a target the longer they are healed.

  2. #2
    Prophet of Telara Corian's Avatar
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    Or, people can stop using dps builds for PvP, and actually get the utility skills they need to shut down things like excessive healing.

    but who am i kidding trion's already shown time and time again that they're going to cater to their worst players.
    This is why we can't have nice things.

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    Question to the OP, are you P6 fully geared? Once you reach that point and have the same problems still, then we can talk.

    I'll be surprised if you and an equally P6 geared friend of yours can't kill a P6 healer on your own by then, with relatively ease (depending on his cooldowns).
    Last edited by Xasapis; 06-03-2011 at 10:27 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Corian View Post
    Or, people can stop using dps builds for PvP, and actually get the utility skills they need to shut down things like excessive healing.

    but who am i kidding trion's already shown time and time again that they're going to cater to their worst players.
    excessive burst negates excessive healing, or such seems to be the general trend.

    what about the occassional nightblade combos that crit for 2k through ~17% valor while mindlessly applying proc heal debuffs? Or the champs that do roughly the same thing?

    Getting utility like a heal debuff isnt always an either/or situation.

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    Sez
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    The biggest issue with PvP is that when someone dies, they get mad. When someone gets mad, they tend to exaggerate.

    No matter what the problem is, the complainer is probably exaggerating.
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    Ascendant Eughe's Avatar
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    As soon as they make damage have dr and put a cap on how many people can hit 1 target, ill agree to it

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    Champion of Telara xaed's Avatar
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    Heals don't need DR's, but they DO need to scale accordingly in PvP and be brought inline w/ damage scaling, and CC DR's.

    It's a bit outrageous how damage is mitigated by around 30% and yet healing is still 100% effective.
    A PRO QUOTE BELOW:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stigas View Post
    You seem to be happy with Eradicate. I'm glad. The longer it stays in, the better. It's a non-threat spec. You're there to Purge things. I can avoid that by either making sure you're focused first, to which you have no answer, or I can go Pyro or SC and let you Eradicate all day.

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    Plane Walker
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    Quote Originally Posted by xaed View Post
    Heals don't need DR's, but they DO need to scale accordingly in PvP and be brought inline w/ damage scaling, and CC DR's.

    It's a bit outrageous how damage is mitigated by around 30% and yet healing is still 100% effective.
    If healing is 100% effective, you're playing vs a bad team. VS good teams healing is 50% at the most or less depending on the classes that focus a target.

    Considering also that dps in the game is about 20-30% higher than hps, then it becomes even more important to apply the debuff.
    Last edited by Xasapis; 06-03-2011 at 10:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xaed View Post
    Heals don't need DR's, but they DO need to scale accordingly in PvP and be brought inline w/ damage scaling, and CC DR's.

    It's a bit outrageous how damage is mitigated by around 30% and yet healing is still 100% effective.
    Warrior healing debuff is not able to be cleansed while incoming damage decreasers can be..
    "Power is neccessary because conflict will never dissappear"

  10. #10
    Plane Touched
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    I hear 1000X more complaints in game about how sky high damge is and one shots then there being too much healing. The too much healing complaint almost always comes from the worst players who never do anything but pug ever.

  11. #11
    Banned Cyborg's Avatar
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    I say ,self healing should have a cap ..Like double of your hp bar . I remeber a cleric and kill it but was my first victim in wf and i was looking at my damage was like 22k .... pff

  12. #12
    General of Telara
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    Joe bad doesn't know how to play and ask for a healing nerf. This is a serious learn to play issue. Did you bring your max dps pve raid build into wf and couldn't kill anyone? PvP is about burst. Learn to play and maybe you won't be making such stupid posts. I'll be honest with you. In my premade, no cleric or two can keep someone up under an assist train with a MM spamming eradicate and warrior heal debuffing. Healing should be buffed not nerfed. Currently we run a warrior (champ/vk/para), pyro mage, MM rogue, and 2 clerics. I have not seen anyone that does not die within 5 seconds. This applies even vs rank 6 premades.

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara xaed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xasapis View Post
    If healing is 100% effective, you're playing vs a bad team. VS good teams healing is 50% at the most or less depending on the classes that focus a target.

    Considering also that dps in the game is about 20-30% higher than hps, then it becomes even more important to apply the debuff.
    That's not the point, and is a poor argument. Hell, by that same argument you have healing increase too, and healing procs as well.

    debuffing shouldn't be the ONLY solution. Healing raid boss damage shouldn't be the case in PvP. Either scale it down appropriately and bring it in like w/ damage scaling and CC DR's, or keep eradicate as is.

    Quote Originally Posted by xzaar View Post
    Joe bad doesn't know how to play and ask for a healing nerf. This is a serious learn to play issue. Did you bring your max dps pve raid build into wf and couldn't kill anyone? PvP is about burst. Learn to play and maybe you won't be making such stupid posts. I'll be honest with you. In my premade, no cleric or two can keep someone up under an assist train with a MM spamming eradicate and warrior heal debuffing. Healing should be buffed not nerfed. Currently we run a warrior (champ/vk/para), pyro mage, MM rogue, and 2 clerics. I have not seen anyone that does not die within 5 seconds. This applies even vs rank 6 premades.
    Yeah, funny how clerics bring their best raid healing spec and do just fine.
    Last edited by xaed; 06-03-2011 at 11:05 AM.
    A PRO QUOTE BELOW:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stigas View Post
    You seem to be happy with Eradicate. I'm glad. The longer it stays in, the better. It's a non-threat spec. You're there to Purge things. I can avoid that by either making sure you're focused first, to which you have no answer, or I can go Pyro or SC and let you Eradicate all day.

  14. #14
    Prophet of Telara Skryth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xaed View Post


    Yeah, funny how clerics bring their best raid healing spec and do just fine.
    You just showed you have no clue what you're talking about.
    Jolly fat people are living proof that it is not possible to "laugh your *** off", though we're trying...

  15. #15
    Champion of Telara xaed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skryth View Post
    You just showed you have no clue what you're talking about.
    Here's the thing and it's so simple..

    PvP scaling:

    valor mitigates damage, CC's have DR's. What does healing have? that's right, NADA.
    A PRO QUOTE BELOW:
    Quote Originally Posted by Stigas View Post
    You seem to be happy with Eradicate. I'm glad. The longer it stays in, the better. It's a non-threat spec. You're there to Purge things. I can avoid that by either making sure you're focused first, to which you have no answer, or I can go Pyro or SC and let you Eradicate all day.

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