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Thread: looking around the threads i see a terrible omen for the maturity of this game

  1. #1
    Shadowlander
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    Default looking around the threads i see a terrible omen for the maturity of this game

    look at how many people are getting into the damage meters/parsers. turning this game into the number crunching that wow was. this bids ill to the future of these 1337 kitties running raids. i see in the near future "need 2 dps must maintain 'X' dps pst"

    we ran vanilla wow fine without dps meters thank you and it was better then any expansion

  2. #2
    Sword of Telara
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    Mister Poopyhead.

  3. #3
    Rift Disciple Kysiel's Avatar
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    OMFG YES BUT PYRO AR- oh wait this isnt another complaint about pyro's thread, my bad.
    ~Kysiel@blightweald~
    <Specialisation: my mace, your face.>

  4. #4
    Plane Walker Qlippoth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrredek View Post
    look at how many people are getting into the damage meters/parsers. turning this game into the number crunching that wow was. this bids ill to the future of these 1337 kitties running raids. i see in the near future "need 2 dps must maintain 'X' dps pst"

    we ran vanilla wow fine without dps meters thank you and it was better then any expansion
    Math is for immature people?
    What do mature people do? Liberal arts?

    By the way, "vanilla was better" doesn't make you mature, makes you a "rose-tinted glasses wearing whiner".

  5. #5
    Rift Disciple Achenar's Avatar
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    I know whatcha mean but it's like colour vs black and white films.

    I miss EQ with enormous death penalties, 3 hr corpse runs, open world dungeons, no AH, 8 spell slots only, having to stare at my spell book for hours to regen mana and so many other things that simply have no place in a modern MMO.

    You can't go back. Parsers are here to stay.

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple
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    Pyros are OP! TRION please nerf asap!

    Edit: Oh sorry, this actually wasnt a pyro thread!
    Vinther/Vintr/Amerika/Bossmode

  7. #7
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Achenar View Post
    I miss EQ with enormous death penalties, 3 hr corpse runs, open world dungeons, no AH, 8 spell slots only, having to stare at my spell book for hours to regen mana and so many other things that simply have no place in a modern MMO.

    You can't go back. Parsers are here to stay.
    Ohh the memories....
    Quote Originally Posted by Detill5869 View Post
    5000 damage reminds me why I started a mage. can't wait to hit 50 and kill lots of players in pvp with my 5000 damage attacks.

  8. #8
    Soulwalker
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    There's really no need for another of these threads since there's been about a thousand of them, but I've not voiced my opinion so too bad, now you get to hear it.

    Would it really be harmful to implement an in-game, optionally viewable damage meter that shows 'your own' damage?

    There are practice dummies in the cities... I'd like to see what works and what doesn't work, I'd like to see what rotation is a more efficient one, etc etc. Currently wailing on a target dummy is like shooting a basketball with your eyes closed, you do not improve without the feedback of knowing which shots make the net.

    Make a built in damage meter that shows your own damage. This satisfies the people who want to know their own damage w/o promoting group kicking from scrubs that think they're elitist, and all the other things people that people fear from a dps meter mentality ("must have 5500 gs, pst", etc)

    I've tried the available parsers and holy hell is that awkward and more hassle than it's worth, as a sidenote.


    A lot of people are concerned about the mentality and attitude of people that jerk off their epeen to meters, and a lot of people want to improve their performance in game without relying on an awkward parser you have to tab out for. I'm sure there is a healthy middle ground to be found.

  9. #9
    Plane Walker
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    The people running parses and discussing results are the mature ones. The problem people are the ones that have no math to back up their claims that are whining because they lost in PvP.

    These people are the ones that make any discussion about useless, because any attempt to bring facts out about what is wrong ends up with a majority of the posts being "OMG NERF XXX" and posts or threads that arent childish in nature just get drowned out.

  10. #10
    Rift Chaser
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    theorycrafting and running damage meters / parsers is here to stay.

    it's going to be around in literally every mmo from this point forwards.

    even if it's absolutely not supported in any way by the game then people are still going to be sitting down crunching numbers and running the math on output based on gcd and timers etc.

    it's something that some people enjoy doing, sure a lot of people don't like the results of it (min maxed builds and elitism) but there's literally nothing anyone can do to prevent it happening.

    it's like things like deadly boss mobs on wow, people say it simplified fights too much, what they don't realise is that before that was around raiding guilds used to make it someone at the raids job to sit there with a stop watch to say when timed effects were about to go off.

    People take quite heavy measures to raid, because in a lot of circumstances it makes their lives playing the game less frustrating and rewards them with some kind of status amoungst the online community.. the people who hate parsers aren't the people those people care about having status with, it's the other people that care about parsers and care about what dps they're putting out and what level of progression their guild is on.. those are those peoples peers, not the people that hate parsers and dps meters.

    Honestly, I think it might be best if some people just started guilds and recruited with messages like 'we don't care about parser damage' then you could play with those guys and it would be awesome for you, because the theorycrafters are always going to want to hang out with other people like themselves and be elitist in that way.

  11. #11
    Ascendant ShalarLight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathmaster35 View Post
    The people running parses and discussing results are the mature ones. The problem people are the ones that have no math to back up their claims that are whining because they lost in PvP.

    These people are the ones that make any discussion about useless, because any attempt to bring facts out about what is wrong ends up with a majority of the posts being "OMG NERF XXX" and posts or threads that arent childish in nature just get drowned out.

    Mmmm, its not running the parsers, its running the parsers, finding a 2-3% gain in a spec, and then claiming everyone else is wrong and bad for not using the exact same spec, keyboard layout, and macros you the person running the parser was using. Also, having a parser doesnt magically make you understand synergy and tactics.

  12. #12
    Ascendant ShalarLight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anchor View Post
    theorycrafting and running damage meters / parsers is here to stay.

    it's going to be around in literally every mmo from this point forwards.

    even if it's absolutely not supported in any way by the game then people are still going to be sitting down crunching numbers and running the math on output based on gcd and timers etc.

    it's something that some people enjoy doing, sure a lot of people don't like the results of it (min maxed builds and elitism) but there's literally nothing anyone can do to prevent it happening.

    it's like things like deadly boss mobs on wow, people say it simplified fights too much, what they don't realise is that before that was around raiding guilds used to make it someone at the raids job to sit there with a stop watch to say when timed effects were about to go off.

    People take quite heavy measures to raid, because in a lot of circumstances it makes their lives playing the game less frustrating and rewards them with some kind of status amoungst the online community.. the people who hate parsers aren't the people those people care about having status with, it's the other people that care about parsers and care about what dps they're putting out and what level of progression their guild is on.. those are those peoples peers, not the people that hate parsers and dps meters.

    Honestly, I think it might be best if some people just started guilds and recruited with messages like 'we don't care about parser damage' then you could play with those guys and it would be awesome for you, because the theorycrafters are always going to want to hang out with other people like themselves and be elitist in that way.

    You can take your "you have 2 skill points assigned differently than the FoTM parser fan club cookie cutter spec, so you we get to belittle you" idea of what MMO's are and set sail, I for one have no intrest in finding the "One" Spec.

    And No, We are all Peers here, We all pay for the game. An example of someone not at the peer level with us would be a GM or a Trion employee. Running a parser in no way makes you "above" people that dont run parsers, you are fooling yourself.
    Last edited by ShalarLight; 04-08-2011 at 05:51 AM.

  13. #13
    Rift Disciple Brickz's Avatar
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    To be honest, I've kind of given up on debate, at least temporarily. When Champion was the big scream, myself and a handful of others tried to tell people that testing had been done, and that it was in fact broken Paragon talents causing the issue. And the majority of posters, having read this, screamed that Champion abilities needed their damage reduced. We argued no, not at all, well maybe. But we won't know till we see what they do when the Paragon talents arent fixed. And they were like...
    http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/425/karmajc5.jpg
    So then it moved to Path of Wind.. and we said yes exactly but the Parag- "NERF IT!".

    So now we're on Pyros. We know its out of hand, hell I AM a pyro(among other things), its out of hand. We attempted civil discussions. Whats the problem? It came back

    -Multiple Weapon Stacking
    -The red orb
    -Cinderburst coefficient
    -Instant Cinderburst
    -Fumilate
    -GoS
    -The combination of offense and escapes
    -Im not sure but when im close to one I just explode
    - etc etc

    And we cant even try to nail down the source of the problem as we did with Champions. And I KNOW you all have an answer for this, but it differs from person to person. To think that Trion isn't aware of this is absolutely absurd, of course they are. They'll adjust it as fast as they can. Do you really think they'd address this forum? I wouldn't It'd look like this...
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zDAmPIq29ro

    Perhaps an announcement of awareness will help, like it did with Champagons, but even then we had to repost that they are aware of the issue in multiple threads. So I think alot of folks, including myself, have temporarily given up on civil discussion, and instead turned to humor, cause its a helluva lot more fun, and it appears people are gonna scream till its over anyways. I'd like nothing more than to see this change and be civil, but im gonna keep a light heart and joke around till then, its not immaturity, im just not holding my breath. Only Wardens can do that forever...

    Damn OP Clerics....
    I fight for the Users

  14. #14
    Champion Stupot's Avatar
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    The strength of support classes in this game is not to be underestimated.

    Very few builds offer 0 support, and I think you'll find mature players realise than whilst the RB is doing a sick 1.5K DPS on that trash pack, the chloro was covering the splash dmge, the Shaman was debuffing those around him and healing, the healer....was healing and the tank was also debuff the mobs.

    There just isn't a pure vs hybrid battle until you get to endgame wherein the challenge is increased as so requires min maxing otherwise it's easy.

  15. #15
    Rift Disciple darkwarrior42's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, what part of actually caring how well I do implies that I'm immature?

    By that logic, people that look to improve their performance in the workplace are immature as well...

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