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Thread: 1.1 and how it seems to be affecting PVE/PVP.

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple CaliberXIII's Avatar
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    Lightbulb 1.1 and how it seems to be affecting PVE/PVP.

    I've hit a roadblock with RIFT, i truly have.
    These are my current thoughts/opinions on what the current state of the game seems to be.

    As of 1.1:
    PVP:
    Rogues: Next to Useless.
    Warriors: Not much better. If well geared, can usually manage unless a flurry of Pyros, then it's gameover.
    Clerics? Fairly Good, they've always seemed to be Decent.
    Mages? Pyros; equivelant of a raid-boss. Stun immunity, Dmg immunity, general Overpowered damage. (Check countless threads of pyros hitting 5k+ on single targets) They seem worse now than warriors/sabs ever were.

    PVE:
    Rogues: Really only good for Tanking/mild DPS, and even then they're still having trouble.
    Warriors: Pigeonholed into tanking due to lack of sufficient DPS trees/souls.
    Clerics: Still viable all-round, really. Somehow they seem the most 'balanced'.
    Mages: Pyro's seem to be DPS kings. A standard party seems to be Tank/Mage/Mage/Mage/Healer..

    In attempting balance at PVP, PVE has suffered Miserably.
    The 1.1 changes seem to have destroyed much of the flexibility that trees/souls offer, thus classes have been Pidgeonholed into the best tree they have, ie: Warriors, tanking. Mages, Pyro. etc.

    What this means to me, personally, is that the game isn't as fun anymore.
    PVP is very one-sided; Who ever has the most Pyromages, wins.
    PVE is less rewarding and takes too long to get anywhere or accomplish anything.

    I've noticed these right around the servers. The countless forum posts (excluding the idioic "THIS IS OP, NERF IT" or "OMG QQ I GOT NERFED" Posts. There;'s many intelligent posts and discussions from people who generally have the same concern i do.

    I've stopped playing RIFT, the 1.1 changes were too negative for me and have turned me against playing it for now.

    How about you guys? What are your concerns? Constructive/Intelligent Criticism Welcomed.
    1.1 Put RIFT in Intensive-Care Ward.
    50 Warrior

  2. #2
    Soulwalker
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    I put my toons on the shelf and will most likely turn off my account. The game was fun but now the classes are all over the place and actually made me think of going to play wow. Once I thought that I knew it was time to walk away and go play something else and it will not be wow as I hated playing that and now this game has turned me off.

  3. #3
    Ascendant Xvvt's Avatar
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    I have been seeing this sentiment a lot the past few days. Pvp queue times have gone up drastically as well. When you do get in, it will have a ton of pyros. Luckily most pyros are awful, but the good ones just destroy everyone.

    One thing that is really discouraging is what you were hitting on, the callings got pigeon holed with 1.1 to a good degree.

    Trion really needs to address the playerbase, so many are cancelling right now that it is seeding other cancelled accounts.

  4. #4
    Champion Dink's Avatar
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    Rift patch 1.1 names:

    1 - "Now Your Back In Azeroth"
    2 - "We've Returned To Azeroth"
    3 - "Coming Home To Azeroth"
    4 - "Unbalanced Rift Sends Us To Azeroth"

  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    Default Cant belive how bad it gotten so fast

    I have alpha and beta tested so many games. i started playing sence the realm 1st mmo out there by sierra back in 90s. Excuse my spelling sence i speak a few tongs this is my 4th launge i speak. PVP seen free mmo lack a good look. But have good open pvp wolrd. You have a few citys that players cant take over. build control a castle in that city. The guild that takes the city place a tax rare on that city or those city. They get a % of all the selling buying that gos on in that city. you get better Free buffs the more city you get. need built siage weapons to help you take city. Cant belive that the reaver paladin tank class got so nerf becuse QQ out there saying we tank to hard, who said this maily assasin mages or clerics that tank better then tanks do. Tank war shude not have range, But they shude run Head on into the mist the fight tank munti targets thats there entire perpose. i cant keep ageo my area effect agro gone. other classes keep better agro then we do. been playing sence beta. And dont recall tomany players QQ in beta cuse this. We go life and the only class i enjoy playing gets nerf so bad that a plate heavy armor tank cant hold agro or use the shield power paladin had to heal himself. that help him to be a tank. Reasver cant have the same agro as he did nether. if i wanted to heal ill play a cleric range a ranger Uber dps a 2 hand war and assasin but i wanted to tank i play a tank. well every one is leaving tanks oit of expert T2 dungens. Why well we have become usless the tank role is not the best tank. he cant even hold agro muchless stay up in battle or heal himself as a paladin did. Why use a tank when you can take acleric a cleric to tank. why go to expers that need range weapons sence we have no range we dont Dps so what is our role now. we have non. i know ill have rest classes that QQ about paladin reaver been umber say manything about this. not all pretty am sure. well fact is if i wanted to heal ill lay a cleric if i want DPS assasin Ranger for range and mage as well. We where fine befor all this nerfs every one KNEW there roles now we dont. they want a single class to be best at everything. a godly class. rest we will fade into nothingness. Well it work. i did say to my self. ill never leave this game. they lisen to the players they seam to lisen to us. YOU are lising to Wrong players. the players that will leave. after a new game comes out like TaraGuild wars 2 or new Star wars Game. then they do same to those games. lisen i played games like EQ 1 for 10 years. was not only one. do the Dollar math. all this kids crying QQ about classes been to strong to weak to this that. Are classes that are in way supose to be weak in melee or Bad in range or Bad in area effect or cloth leather or chailmain wanting to tank like a heavy plate user. you ruin the game. thking about Goin back to AoC or OMG EQ 1 even do is so outdated at least i know my Role. fun we can jump 1 role to another. But the class that main porpose sopose to be a healer shude be best healer the range class shude be best range class and the best tank class shude be best tank class. you where off to such a good start. and you ruin the game so fast. you need to know when not to lisen to players also. so you game wont be ruin. am so sad so disapointed. am about to stop my 60 dollar every 6 moth payment. i was goin to be here for good. But lack of Rewrds open pvp wolrd and hard nerfing of classes drove me out after trying so many builds non will be a tank tanks and or a 2 handed weapons Dps sux now to. Huge battle axe shude out Dps a 2 sword user. by force alone and the hit a huge axe 2 hand axe dos more dmg then 2 swords. Assasin i under stand they go cri hit fraging spots but a paragon a plate user been so nimble. i quit.

  6. #6
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaliberXIII View Post
    PVE:
    Rogues: Really only good for Tanking/mild DPS, and even then they're still having trouble.
    Warriors: Pigeonholed into tanking due to lack of sufficient DPS trees/souls.
    Clerics: Still viable all-round, really. Somehow they seem the most 'balanced'.
    Mages: Pyro's seem to be DPS kings. A standard party seems to be Tank/Mage/Mage/Mage/Healer..
    Most of this is pretty inaccurate.

    The problem with rogue/warrior dps is not their inability to do dps. NB does plenty of dps so does a properly specced warrior. The problem is entirely too many mobs are melee unfriendly. Even in the easiest expert (FC) 3 of the 6 bosses are really punishing to melee (sparkwing, tephra lord, Vallnara)

    Also pyro are not "dps kings" at all. They do less dps than a properly specced nb or Bm/champ/para on a fight where they both never have to move. Hell they even lose to lots of mage specs.

  7. #7
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gandohar View Post
    I have alpha and beta tested so many games. i started playing sence the realm 1st mmo out there by sierra back in 90s. Excuse my spelling sence i speak a few tongs this is my 4th launge i speak. PVP seen free mmo lack a good look. But have good open pvp wolrd. You have a few citys that players cant take over. build control a castle in that city. The guild that takes the city place a tax rare on that city or those city. They get a % of all the selling buying that gos on in that city. you get better Free buffs the more city you get. need built siage weapons to help you take city. Cant belive that the reaver paladin tank class got so nerf becuse QQ out there saying we tank to hard, who said this maily assasin mages or clerics that tank better then tanks do. Tank war shude not have range, But they shude run Head on into the mist the fight tank munti targets thats there entire perpose. i cant keep ageo my area effect agro gone. other classes keep better agro then we do. been playing sence beta. And dont recall tomany players QQ in beta cuse this. We go life and the only class i enjoy playing gets nerf so bad that a plate heavy armor tank cant hold agro or use the shield power paladin had to heal himself. that help him to be a tank. Reasver cant have the same agro as he did nether. if i wanted to heal ill play a cleric range a ranger Uber dps a 2 hand war and assasin but i wanted to tank i play a tank. well every one is leaving tanks oit of expert T2 dungens. Why well we have become usless the tank role is not the best tank. he cant even hold agro muchless stay up in battle or heal himself as a paladin did. Why use a tank when you can take acleric a cleric to tank. why go to expers that need range weapons sence we have no range we dont Dps so what is our role now. we have non. i know ill have rest classes that QQ about paladin reaver been umber say manything about this. not all pretty am sure. well fact is if i wanted to heal ill lay a cleric if i want DPS assasin Ranger for range and mage as well. We where fine befor all this nerfs every one KNEW there roles now we dont. they want a single class to be best at everything. a godly class. rest we will fade into nothingness. Well it work. i did say to my self. ill never leave this game. they lisen to the players they seam to lisen to us. YOU are lising to Wrong players. the players that will leave. after a new game comes out like TaraGuild wars 2 or new Star wars Game. then they do same to those games. lisen i played games like EQ 1 for 10 years. was not only one. do the Dollar math. all this kids crying QQ about classes been to strong to weak to this that. Are classes that are in way supose to be weak in melee or Bad in range or Bad in area effect or cloth leather or chailmain wanting to tank like a heavy plate user. you ruin the game. thking about Goin back to AoC or OMG EQ 1 even do is so outdated at least i know my Role. fun we can jump 1 role to another. But the class that main porpose sopose to be a healer shude be best healer the range class shude be best range class and the best tank class shude be best tank class. you where off to such a good start. and you ruin the game so fast. you need to know when not to lisen to players also. so you game wont be ruin. am so sad so disapointed. am about to stop my 60 dollar every 6 moth payment. i was goin to be here for good. But lack of Rewrds open pvp wolrd and hard nerfing of classes drove me out after trying so many builds non will be a tank tanks and or a 2 handed weapons Dps sux now to. Huge battle axe shude out Dps a 2 sword user. by force alone and the hit a huge axe 2 hand axe dos more dmg then 2 swords. Assasin i under stand they go cri hit fraging spots but a paragon a plate user been so nimble. i quit.

    Are you kidding me, I couldn't read past the first line. That wall of text crit me for 10k....ouch

  8. #8
    Rift Disciple CaliberXIII's Avatar
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    bump
    /10...
    1.1 Put RIFT in Intensive-Care Ward.
    50 Warrior

  9. #9
    Rift Master
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    bugs are bugs. game is pretty new and its going to have somethings to work out. that said, the design of the game is terrible and the devs are totally responsible for that.

    damage reduction being additive and not multiplicative is not a bug and not a mistake. it is by design. it is also not something that just slips through. i have been posting on it for some time. several people have been posting on it for sometime. nothing has been done.

    it was VERY GOOD that they fixed the bugs with para. it was VERY GOOD that they wanted to address mage concerns and give them some buffs. it was VERY GOOD for them to realize that fixing the para bugs brought them too low and so to adjust for that.

    it is VERY BAD for them to leave melee clerics as they are. it is VERY BAD for them to have their spell coefficients all screwed up like they do. it is VERY BAD that they have left melee AND ranged rogues in the state they are in. it is VERY BAD that they buffed mages through buffing PYRO and GOS.

    they had SEVEN betas to adjust for several DESIGN problems and they didn't. they had plenty of time and they had ALL the accurate feedback they needed. they did not act. they sat on their hands and invested their energy in the wrong directions and the wrong places.

    when the game is out a bit over a month and you have a major balancing patch that actually changes NOTHING except WHO the op soul/spec/class is then it is a crap game. they could have been more careful with both buffs and nerfs. it is NOT that we have MERELY op specs/souls/classes it IS that we have GROSSLY HUGELY OVERWHELMINGLY op specs/souls/classes.

    the fact of the current mmo market is that you DO NOT have over a month on initial release to get the game to a place where it is not tyrannized GROSSLY HUGELY OVERWHELMINGLY op specs/classes/souls. you CAN have bugs and what-not that need to get worked out, but you have to have a good design that provides a minimum of balance, interaction, and challenge for pvp and pve. you have betas and probably one major patch to accomplish this task. you DON'T have to be perfect... you DO have to get a minimum level of success. TRION failed. RIFT is dying.

    new people are coming in. more people are leaving. i have seen several strong guilds die. i have seen population in areas dwindle and fall off. i have seen que times increase in huge ways. i have been sticking it out in part cause there was still enough people around. even if the game was great... if no one plays it then it doesn't work. this game now seems to be losing too much population to be viable.

    TRION could have saved this sad situation with better and more regular interaction and feedback with its player-base. good communication goes a long way. they would then have to also act and make adjustments in game, but good communication can buy the time you need to make the changes.

    i am playing other games now.

  10. #10
    Champion
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    Account expires on the 4th. Won't be back unless my Rogue is made good at something. Probably not even then.

    You hit the nail right on the head with this statement:
    ".
    The 1.1 changes seem to have destroyed much of the flexibility that trees/souls offer, thus classes have been Pidgeonholed into the best tree they have, ie: Warriors, tanking. Mages, Pyro. etc.
    "

    The fundamental design of Rift is that souls were meant to be flexible, dynamic, interesting. Well, that's not how the game works now that you've adopted WoW's idiotic "roller coaster balance" model. Classes will be pigeonholed into whatever soul works best (if you're a Rogue, "whatever soul sucks least"). If a patch buffs one soul, and nerfs another, you take that one. You're very quickly killing the very concept on which you founded this game, because, rather than have 2-3 souls in each calling that can do one thing effectively, you have 1, at most (0 for some, e.g. "Rogue DPS" and "Rogue Support"). Thus every PVE Mage is forced to play Pyro or Chloromancer.

    Thing is, that's not fun. And, more importantly, there's already an established MMO out there where each class has one functional build and a bunch of crap ones. That game has every feature you have, except the rifts (which become utterly irrelevant at level 50). That game is World of Warcraft. And they have 10 classes, not four.
    Kashta, 50 Rogue / Gwythiant, 41 Cleric / Ampere, 37 Mage

  11. #11
    Plane Touched Reyo's Avatar
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    I pretty much agree with the OP about the current state of the game.

  12. #12
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaliberXIII View Post
    I've hit a roadblock with RIFT, i truly have.
    These are my current thoughts/opinions on what the current state of the game seems to be.

    As of 1.1:
    PVP:
    Rogues: Next to Useless.
    Warriors: Not much better. If well geared, can usually manage unless a flurry of Pyros, then it's gameover.
    Clerics? Fairly Good, they've always seemed to be Decent.
    Mages? Pyros; equivelant of a raid-boss. Stun immunity, Dmg immunity, general Overpowered damage. (Check countless threads of pyros hitting 5k+ on single targets) They seem worse now than warriors/sabs ever were.

    PVE:
    Rogues: Really only good for Tanking/mild DPS, and even then they're still having trouble.
    Warriors: Pigeonholed into tanking due to lack of sufficient DPS trees/souls.
    Clerics: Still viable all-round, really. Somehow they seem the most 'balanced'.
    Mages: Pyro's seem to be DPS kings. A standard party seems to be Tank/Mage/Mage/Mage/Healer..

    In attempting balance at PVP, PVE has suffered Miserably.
    The 1.1 changes seem to have destroyed much of the flexibility that trees/souls offer, thus classes have been Pidgeonholed into the best tree they have, ie: Warriors, tanking. Mages, Pyro. etc.

    What this means to me, personally, is that the game isn't as fun anymore.
    PVP is very one-sided; Who ever has the most Pyromages, wins.
    PVE is less rewarding and takes too long to get anywhere or accomplish anything.

    I've noticed these right around the servers. The countless forum posts (excluding the idioic "THIS IS OP, NERF IT" or "OMG QQ I GOT NERFED" Posts. There;'s many intelligent posts and discussions from people who generally have the same concern i do.

    I've stopped playing RIFT, the 1.1 changes were too negative for me and have turned me against playing it for now.

    How about you guys? What are your concerns? Constructive/Intelligent Criticism Welcomed.
    This is the last day I can post, since I cancelled both accounts, so I might as well get my complaint in.

    I play tanks and rangers for mains in every MMO I've played since 2003. I'm not out for uber, I just want something that's fun to play and allows you to solo efficiently.

    I started Rift in closed Beta, and loved it. I mainly played a void knight/paladin combo, got to level 28, had fun. I was not walzing over either PVE or PVP targets, so I wasn't exactly happy when void knight was nerfed because some of the higher level abilities I didn't have yet were too powerful or buggy.

    So during live, I played void knight/paladin till 28, and indeed, the levelling was a lot slower and frankly less fun. One of the nerfed abilities had a big impact on low level gameplay, which is, imho, not a smart thing to do ever. So I switched to a riftblade / paladin combo and hit 50 with it (mostly riftblade, 20 pts paladin). And once again the nerfbat hit. Our main AP builder now isn't on global cooldown anymore, it's on a 4 second timer.

    What struck me most about these nerfs is that they are essentially stupid. In my personal experience, my soul combo was not particularly uber. In PVP I wasn't facerolling entire groups my own level or even in 1 v 1. In PVE I frankly died more on the warrior than on the ranger/marksman. But still, I'll allow the parse might tell a different story.

    But here's where the stupid comes in. If in some soul combinations, abilities are too powerful, then the synergy between those souls could be changed. If the flame spear was doing too much damage (and it was not doing all that much more than the spammable melee attack), then it could have been toned down. If the finishers were doing too much damage, then those could have been toned down. If DPS output was not in line with the amount of base health warriors have, than THAT could have been toned down (with a bigger increase in health to those who choose tank souls in order to compensate). In stead, they severely nerfed the riftblade's ability to be a ranged warrior. They're basically telling you to get in melee range to build AP, then use your (all ranged) finisher... which is just silly, and which pretty much destroys what made the sould unique.

    So sure, I could switch to a combination of Riftblade and Paragon to stay a ranged warrior. Although I'd lose the extra health and survivability Paladin gives, I'd get (a lot) more damage, and I could set up a macro for a ranged AP building rotation. But call me a traditionalist... I think ANY combination should be good and fun to play, I hate being forced into a one-true-build situation. And of course, the build will only survive until the next nerf.

    And that's just it, I guess. The next nerf. Too much uninformed screaming in the forums, too many who insist everything should be the same as in all other games. There WILL be a next nerf. And I've little hope it will be any better conceived than the current batch, which seems to consists of mostly kneejerk reactions to nerf cries in stead of real tweaks and balance adjustments.

    For once, my warrior could go toe to toe with the mages in PVP, where in other games they just CC you and nuke you from range, killing you long before you ever get into melee range. I find it suppremely ironic so many of said mages are complaining about warriors wearing plate, while plate gives no magic defense whatsoever.

    Tips for Trion:
    - FIX THE CROWD CONTROL. Don't make the same mistake WAR made. Introduce working immunity timers, and only THEN start tweaking classes.
    - Don't remove the things that make souls unique. Keep the versatility you first envisioned.

    Linna Baresi
    <Fated>

  13. #13
    Rift Master Arcticred's Avatar
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    Agree totaly with the OP.

    I have been saying this since 1.1 hit. The game has totaly gone to pot imho.

    People in my guild dont even log on anymore, cant find a PUG party with my rogue because in most cases rogues arent welcome in PUG's.
    WF's are terrible now, pyros setting up turrets in all the strategic locations and winning the game without the other team being able to leave their spawn area in alot of games. Premade teams are now fielding 4 - 5 Pyros at a time, fighting vs premades was always hard but still doable if you had a couple of clerics on your team. Now premades are impossible to beat, its got to a stage where im the only person that leaves the spawn the rest just stand there dancing or hurling insults at the Pyros.

    The game has gone from good to terrible overnight.

    I have cancelled my subs aswell, im just gald that 1.1 came out when it did and not a week later because i went for the 3 month option so i would have had to stick around till then.
    http://www.siglaunch.com/sigs/any/2/2/3/7/7/4322377PXOFX.png Only the dead have seen the end of war

  14. #14
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcticred View Post
    Agree totaly with the OP.

    I have been saying this since 1.1 hit. The game has totaly gone to pot imho.

    People in my guild dont even log on anymore, cant find a PUG party with my rogue because in most cases rogues arent welcome in PUG's.
    WF's are terrible now, pyros setting up turrets in all the strategic locations and winning the game without the other team being able to leave their spawn area in alot of games. Premade teams are now fielding 4 - 5 Pyros at a time, fighting vs premades was always hard but still doable if you had a couple of clerics on your team. Now premades are impossible to beat, its got to a stage where im the only person that leaves the spawn the rest just stand there dancing or hurling insults at the Pyros.

    The game has gone from good to terrible overnight.

    I have cancelled my subs aswell, im just gald that 1.1 came out when it did and not a week later because i went for the 3 month option so i would have had to stick around till then.
    +1 /signed and all of that good stuff.

  15. #15
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaliberXIII View Post

    In attempting balance at PVP, PVE has suffered Miserably.
    The 1.1 changes seem to have destroyed much of the flexibility that trees/souls offer, thus classes have been Pidgeonholed into the best tree they have, ie: Warriors, tanking. Mages, Pyro. etc.

    What this means to me, personally, is that the game isn't as fun anymore.
    PVP is very one-sided; Who ever has the most Pyromages, wins.
    PVE is less rewarding and takes too long to get anywhere or accomplish anything.
    True +1, I took a rogue because I like the sab! Now I can't play sab anymore or I just will suck. I felt like they forced me to tank what pretty mutch sucks when you build a dex rogue...

    I loved the game in the betas, I really thought this game was gonna be a very big succes, but then the over rated nerfs of trion... 42% nerf for the sabo? really? who even thinks of this ideas?

    The warrior also, they wern't that op maybe a little but not that mutch!

    I was a pvp player and I'll join the game back untill they fix the sabo and the pyro
    -The Unnamed-
    Whitewidow - Sab
    LVL 50 - Rank 5

    Canceled subscription: 30/03/11

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