How would YOU "fix" sabos?

[Bartimus]

Well, that what I feel will "fix" sabos, kind of like when we took our dog to the vet to be fixed.

Note that I don't play a Sabo, I am just looking at it from a victim's point of view.

As a 40-50 bracket sabo, it think it is working as intended. I am a suicide bomber, I am almost garaunteed a kill... but in a warfront, i immediately die afterward. In the end, I still place low on the damage and kill rating.

From what I understand this is almost identical to Assasin. Perhaps if they reduced our range a bit, that would be enough to balance things out. right now my range is 30, like other ranged dps (but i did spend 5 points to increase it).

[Cybaster]

Saboteur complaints are effectively a giant "I AM STILL LEVEL 30!!!" banner over one's head.

Hit points scale upwards. Saboteur damage falls behind.

[Delphya]

You removed your dog's legs?

Uh.. no.. his other thing...

Some people might call it his 5th leg though...

[Indasoth]

There seems to be a lot of sab hate out there, so instead of adding this onto a 40 page thread of "NERF SABS" I thought it might be useful to ask the community what they think a reasonable fix could be. Personally I do play a sab occaisionally, and if someone came up and asked "SABS need a nerf, how would make them retain their fun factor while expelling the hate?" one of two ways for me:

Simply add a cast time long enough to be interruptible to detonate, allowing another avenue in addition to cleanse or CC to prevent the massive backloaded damage we all know and love. Keep the big numbers at the risk of more vulnerability.

Or, my personal fav, make charges melée range, greatly Increasing the danger level to apply them. Maybe add a talent that makes them able to not break stealth in addition to adding a cast time to detonate. Would have to be deep in the tree but would alert anyone to a destealthing casting rogue causing them to say "OMG" *stun interrupt faceroll* if they were quick enough.

There it is. More suggestions welcome!

Take off the "This attack never misses, and cannot be parried, dodged or blocked." of Detonate, for starters...

[kungfuchknoodle]

Saboteur complaints are effectively a giant "I AM STILL LEVEL 30!!!" banner over one's head.

Hit points scale upwards. Saboteur damage falls behind.

Falls behind health maxes, not other soul dps. And its still pretty bad up to 39.

And they get great CC/utility with it.

The one shotting goes bye bye for most classes (pyro health still sucks if they arent on the circle), but still a noticeably above par soul if you get your head out of charge-spam hurr hurr hurr mode.

Probably going to make one of my roles guardian stance riftstalker with sabo once I get my last 5 (more like 4, logged right before hitting 46 T_T) levels. landmine/trap spam with tank stats should be fun, no dps, all CC. Kinda like a Dom who can overextend.

Still not balanced, but eh, without the one shotting its more realistic to get away or fight back.

[Darkhan1]

Sabs only seem to be an issue at low levels. At higher levels almost everything eats them. Healers easily outheal the damage, other rogues stunlock them, warriors either eat them as champs, or win the DPS war as Riftblade, Mages just squirrel them then laugh, then laucnh a fireball in their face before repeating said process.

As you level you'll notice sabs were really only effect against lower players who didn't know what they do. You learn to recognize a sab and that they are really squishy.

Lol you gotta be pretty bad if you think its that easy to beat a sab. Break Free>Squirrel, Cleanse Soul>fireballs+++++++. 5x blast, detonate with anni, while he cant do **** dmg against you, 1 shot mage. Bye bye.

[overbyte]

Well, first, those charges should fall off after 10 seconds. If I recall correctly, they last 30 seconds before they fall off, which is just ridiculous.

[overbyte]

Well, first, those charges should fall off after 10 seconds. If I recall correctly, they last 30 seconds before they fall off, which is just ridiculous.

HATE that 5minute rule...


Well, first, those charges should fall off after 10 seconds. If I recall correctly, they last 30 seconds before they fall off, which is just ridiculous.

Second, charges should be on a 2 second cooldown per cast.

Reduce the damage on detonate. Make each charge do some damage when applied.

Allow each charge to critically hit independently.

Get rid of Rapid Setup.

Make Land Mines the 51 point ability.

Make the 31 point talent something akin to Unstable Affliction from WOW (call it "Sweating Bullets")

- dispelling your charges causes X damage to the dispeller and has a Y% chance to critically detonate all charges on the target and silence the dispeller for 10 seconds

[ShimmerSniper]

HATE that 5minute rule...


Well, first, those charges should fall off after 10 seconds. If I recall correctly, they last 30 seconds before they fall off, which is just ridiculous.

Second, charges should be on a 2 second cooldown per cast.

Reduce the damage on detonate. Make each charge do some damage when applied.

Allow each charge to critically hit independently.

Get rid of Rapid Setup.

Make Land Mines the 51 point ability.

Make the 31 point talent something akin to Unstable Affliction from WOW (call it "Sweating Bullets")

- dispelling your charges causes X damage to the dispeller and has a Y% chance to critically detonate all charges on the target and silence the dispeller for 10 seconds

Why stop there?

Why not also make it so that charges must be placed in melee range.

Get rid of the armor pen of blast charge.. replace it with.. 2% increase in damage per point

Make it so if you detonate in melee range, you take 100% of the damage of the charges + detonation as well. The ranged talent lowers this to 50% of the damage taken.

The anti-aggro talent, since it has to be in melee and charges do damage now, is replaced with a talent that just lowers aggro generation from damage you do by 15% at level 3.

Combat survival, as stimuz points out so very often, is just too powerful. Lower it to 15% per point instead.

Adhesive bomb, 2 second casting time, 50% slow speed, 70% of its former radius, increase cool down by 15%

[overbyte]

Why stop there?

Why not also make it so that charges must be placed in melee range.

Make it so if you detonate in melee range, you take 100% of the damage of the charges + detonation as well. The ranged talent lowers this to 50% of the damage taken.

The problem with these two combined is you would have to *increase* the overall damage from charges+det to even out the DPS lost from running in and out of melee range. This would not be a viable PVE solution, unfortunately.

Not sure about the other stuff - it could work.

[overbyte]

HATE that 5minute rule...
Make the 31 point talent something akin to Unstable Affliction from WOW (call it "Sweating Bullets")

- dispelling your charges causes X damage to the dispeller and has a Y% chance to critically detonate all charges on the target and silence the dispeller for 10 seconds

After consideration, I realized this has 0 PVE benefit. A simple fix would be:

- Your Detonation deals an additional X% of its damage over Y seconds. Additionally, dispelling your charges causes X damage to the dispeller and has a Y% chance to critically detonate all charges on the target and silence the dispeller for 10 seconds

[ShimmerSniper]

The problem with these two combined is you would have to *increase* the overall damage from charges+det to even out the DPS lost from running in and out of melee range. This would not be a viable PVE solution, unfortunately.

Not sure about the other stuff - it could work.

Auto attack did that for us already. Your DPS has been increased. Besides, following stimuz, You can just planeshift away as a riftstalker/sab.

[Roadkillstewie]

uhg, so many of you would end up gutting the class it req someone to pair up the the sab just to run quests/dailies.

[Xavier1]

Just give the rogue calling as a whole the same global cooldown that all the other classes have to endure & I'll be fine.

It will result in a significant dps lose.

[Indasoth]

I never understood the different GCD's by calling...dumb idea and puts certain classes at an immediate disadvantage at level 1.

1.4 - 1.5 sec GCD for all classes.