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Thread: Goddess of Fate, Woragrath and the Vigil

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    Default Goddess of Fate, Woragrath and the Vigil

    Hey guy,
    So as you may have noticed I have kind of tried to join the discussions in here recently, only to realise some of you regulars here know just about "everything" about the lore, meanwhile my only interest in Lore is if an awesome looking character/storyline pops up and I am so intrigued to know more about it and... pretty much... whether or not we are gonna kill that character in a raid.

    So I am truly a beginner at lore, but I feel like I have picked up on some content in the story quests and got an idea of what is going on, only to find out... I didn't follow the stories in story quests pre-nightmare tide.

    Who exactly is the Goddess of Fate? I know she was associated with the Vigil and (I think) allied with the Blood Storm? Since I do not understand anything about the Vigil I was unable to grasp the full concept of the story.

    So the story quest which took place in Cathedral of Canus, which was one of the last, if not the last, quest of the Cosmologist Mann story line, was in my opinion the most intriguing one, the Goddess of Fate seemed so full of hate, which was directed to the Ascended as well as the Akvan (I think), then there is a woman by the name of Pallas who has Woragrath on her shoulder who told Woragrath to refrain from burning down the world, then she got bad news from another woman (I... forgot) about Orphiel (I... think) who created his own "good" Ascended, being us (I... think?), after that she told Woragrath to burn down the world... So i'm confused there, a lot. And then Woragrath kills (or I think finishes her off is the correct term) Lady Glasya in Gyel Fortress, not sure why, and after that two woman (I think Pallas and the woman who told her the bad news) start talking, but you don't see them (I don't think so anyway). Really would love to know a lot more about those 3 people, being the Goddess of Fate, Pallas and Bad News Woman, are these 3 all members of the vigil? Did they all ally with the Blood Storm? How exactly are they associated with the Plane of Fire/Glasya? Dooooo we maybe possibly kill the Goddess of Fate ?These are probably really silly questions, but would love answers.

    Also gonna throw a little bonus question.. or two down here:
    Is Demogos actually dead after we killed him in Draumheim? I forgot if he escaped or something.
    What is the association with Demogos and Lord Arak (If there is even one, but I'm sure there is)?
    Demogos seemed so awesome and bad-azz, I thought he was a great character, besides he outsmarted all of us in Ember Isle! I didn't wanna kill him in the story quest in draumheim, hope he comes back for an awesome spectacle.

    Thanks for reading.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImJosh View Post
    Hey guy,
    So as you may have noticed I have kind of tried to join the discussions in here recently, only to realise some of you regulars here know just about "everything" about the lore, meanwhile my only interest in Lore is if an awesome looking character/storyline pops up and I am so intrigued to know more about it and... pretty much... whether or not we are gonna kill that character in a raid.

    So I am truly a beginner at lore, but I feel like I have picked up on some content in the story quests and got an idea of what is going on, only to find out... I didn't follow the stories in story quests pre-nightmare tide.

    Who exactly is the Goddess of Fate? I know she was associated with the Vigil and (I think) allied with the Blood Storm? Since I do not understand anything about the Vigil I was unable to grasp the full concept of the story.

    So the story quest which took place in Cathedral of Canus, which was one of the last, if not the last, quest of the Cosmologist Mann story line, was in my opinion the most intriguing one, the Goddess of Fate seemed so full of hate, which was directed to the Ascended as well as the Akvan (I think), then there is a woman by the name of Pallas who has Woragrath on her shoulder who told Woragrath to refrain from burning down the world, then she got bad news from another woman (I... forgot) about Orphiel (I... think) who created his own "good" Ascended, being us (I... think?), after that she told Woragrath to burn down the world... So i'm confused there, a lot. And then Woragrath kills (or I think finishes her off is the correct term) Lady Glasya in Gyel Fortress, not sure why, and after that two woman (I think Pallas and the woman who told her the bad news) start talking, but you don't see them (I don't think so anyway). Really would love to know a lot more about those 3 people, being the Goddess of Fate, Pallas and Bad News Woman, are these 3 all members of the vigil? Did they all ally with the Blood Storm? How exactly are they associated with the Plane of Fire/Glasya? Dooooo we maybe possibly kill the Goddess of Fate ?These are probably really silly questions, but would love answers.

    Also gonna throw a little bonus question.. or two down here:
    Is Demogos actually dead after we killed him in Draumheim? I forgot if he escaped or something.
    What is the association with Demogos and Lord Arak (If there is even one, but I'm sure there is)?
    Demogos seemed so awesome and bad-azz, I thought he was a great character, besides he outsmarted all of us in Ember Isle! I didn't wanna kill him in the story quest in draumheim, hope he comes back for an awesome spectacle.

    Thanks for reading.
    I'll try and answer these the best I can in the order you asked them:

    The Vigil were introduced in Vanilla Rift as the 5 gods that created Telara. They are who brought the Guardian Ascended back, and who commanded the Defiants not to use sourcestone technology because it could damage the ward they had helped mortals create to protect Telara from the Blood Storm.

    http://telarapedia.gamepedia.com/Vigil

    The Blood Storm was the 6 dragons that invaded Telara long ago. Each was associated with a different form of destruction, control, power, etc that would have changed and consumed Telara.

    http://telarapedia.gamepedia.com/Blood_Storm

    The Goddess of Fate, named Aia, we didn't even really know existed until recently. There were hints about her in the Dendrome storyline (I'm gonna have to go back and redo that someday, I've forgotten way too much of it). You then encountered her in the last tier of raiding that was released before Nightmare Tide came out.

    She used to be associated with the other 5 gods of the Vigil. They are the ones who imprisoned the Akvan long ago. Somewhere along the line, though, the Vigil apparently broke away from what she, as Fate, planned for the universe, either by creating mortals, or by not allowing them to perish to the Blood Storm, or something along those lines. She then either directly or indirectly helped the Akvan escape their prisons.

    Pallas and her group are known as the Tenebreans. They are very new to us this expansion. There seem to be hints that Orphiel is one of them, but I don't think it's been 100% confirmed yet. They are the ones who gave Glasya the occulons that allowed her to start transforming Goboro Reef into another plane of fire. As to WHY they gave them to her, I'm not sure it's been clearly stated anywhere. They were obviously using her in some way, possibly as another way to weaken this universe in anticipation of their invasion. When it became clear she wasn't useful to them anymore when we beat her in Gyel Fortress, they did away with her.

    So, to wrap it up:

    The Vigil are the 5 gods that created Telara. Considered "good-guys," but we haven't tehcnically heard from them since before the ward was erected around Telara however many years ago that was. It's not even very clear whether they are still around, though their messengers are (the angels you can see in Sanctum once you get planar site).

    The Blood Storm were the original bad guys of Rift. 6 dragons, 5 of them are dead now. We're not sure where Crucia is, though she pops up again every now and then.

    The Akvan are a race of sea-based creatures, very bad guys. Chronologically, they were around BEFORE the Blood Storm, but only recently have they been out of the prison the Vigil locked them in.

    The Tenebreans, based on refereces in game and stuff in the stories released on the website, are a great conquering army. Our universe is their next target. Oh, and they might have their own version of Ascended.

    Aia, Goddess of Fate, is kinda a free agent at this point. She seems to want the destruction of Telara, or at least of mortal life. She keeps claiming that the fate the universe is heading for will be worse with mortals than it would have been without. So she seems to be trying to fix that by killing everyone. Since the Akvan seem to want that as well, it seems to be kind of an "enemy of my enemy if my friend" thing with her.

    Can't answer your questions about Demogos because I'm just totally drawing a blank about who that is. I'm sure someone else here can answer it. Or if I remember I'll add that info later.

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    There was hints at the Fate Goddess since the start of Storm Legion.
    There's a dude in Tempest Bay between the poticulum and the crafting area on the stairs that would have weird signs. One of them mentioned the Fate Goddess and that she (or the Vigil) destroyed the transit system to keep the "divine war" a secret.
    I thought the transit was the train tracks all over, but it appears to have been about the Infinity Gate and the ability to travel the planes.

    Dendrome obviously put her front and center.

    As for her stance, yeah. She clearly doesn't like the "Creation" that the other Vigil did.
    When she broke away from the Vigil, and for what exact reason is unknown.
    It was after the Vigil locked away the Akvan, but before the Ward went up.

    The Tenebreans, as dannuck stated, a new "race" that just showed up in this expansion.
    Yes it's heavily hinted that Orphiel is one, though I don't know if that was intended since the start of the entire game, or if it was just put in to bring him back.
    We don't know what their intent is, we don't know who they are, where they are from, who's side they are on, where they got the power of the oculon from or how many there even are (when you fight the oculon, it states the "23" are coming.
    They are a big question.

    The Vigil are "gods", they created the Guardian Ascended. However their powers are clearly limited.
    There IS a lot about them, but there's a lot not a lot about them.
    I mean we know some of the names they go by, some of things they did, but the extent of their power, where they are, what happened to them, what's up with Aia and the rest of them...We know very little.

    Any story about the Vigil, Aia or the Tenebreans are vague and to little right now. We don't know enough about any of them.

    Will we see Aias visions of doom in future raid slivers, who knows.

    There was a livestream today with the main lore guy mentioned that there WAS a cameo of Orphiel in the expansion, but I for the life of my didn't see it. I've only seen text hints of him.
    I would guess that he was in the short instance where you fight Laythys in Draumheim in the nightmare Meridian, but I can't get back there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hardy83 View Post
    There was hints at the Fate Goddess since the start of Storm Legion.
    There's a dude in Tempest Bay between the poticulum and the crafting area on the stairs that would have weird signs. One of them mentioned the Fate Goddess and that she (or the Vigil) destroyed the transit system to keep the "divine war" a secret.
    I thought the transit was the train tracks all over, but it appears to have been about the Infinity Gate and the ability to travel the planes.

    Dendrome obviously put her front and center.

    As for her stance, yeah. She clearly doesn't like the "Creation" that the other Vigil did.
    When she broke away from the Vigil, and for what exact reason is unknown.
    It was after the Vigil locked away the Akvan, but before the Ward went up.

    The Tenebreans, as dannuck stated, a new "race" that just showed up in this expansion.
    Yes it's heavily hinted that Orphiel is one, though I don't know if that was intended since the start of the entire game, or if it was just put in to bring him back.
    We don't know what their intent is, we don't know who they are, where they are from, who's side they are on, where they got the power of the oculon from or how many there even are (when you fight the oculon, it states the "23" are coming.
    They are a big question.

    The Vigil are "gods", they created the Guardian Ascended. However their powers are clearly limited.
    There IS a lot about them, but there's a lot not a lot about them.
    I mean we know some of the names they go by, some of things they did, but the extent of their power, where they are, what happened to them, what's up with Aia and the rest of them...We know very little.

    Any story about the Vigil, Aia or the Tenebreans are vague and to little right now. We don't know enough about any of them.

    Will we see Aias visions of doom in future raid slivers, who knows.

    There was a livestream today with the main lore guy mentioned that there WAS a cameo of Orphiel in the expansion, but I for the life of my didn't see it. I've only seen text hints of him.
    I would guess that he was in the short instance where you fight Laythys in Draumheim in the nightmare Meridian, but I can't get back there.
    I'm deciding right now whether to start another character from level 60 and do NT stuff over again to catch things I missed, or to start at 50 and do Dendrome/TB stuff for lore's sake, THEN NT stuff again. Either way, at some point I'll be seeing all the NT stuff again. I don't recall seeing Orphiel anywhere, but I wasn't really looking for him, either. For whatever reason, I never drew the conclusions about him until romping through this forum again. I think it's just been too long since he was the focus of... anything, and he wasn't even sitting in the back of my mind to make connections to.

    It would be nice to see some explanation somewhere about why he disappeared in the alternate Defiant future, and left Sylver to finish the work developing the Ascended. It also makes you wonder, if the Tenebreans have Ascended or something similar to them, and it took THAT LONG for an actual Tenebrean to figure out how to do it in our universe (before disappearing and leaving someone else to ACTUALLY figure it out, anyways), then is it also hard for the Tenebreans to create their versions?

    And another thought just occurred. Lets say the united Vigil (all 6 gods) saw the approach of the Tenebreans in the future. Aia (Fate) created a plan to allow their universe to survive in one form or another after the Tenebreans did what they did. The other 5 gods didn't have faith in that plan, and created Telara and mortals to prepare for their arrival. They saw Tenebrean Ascended and planned to create their own version (maybe they did it earlier than originally planned because of the arrival of the Blood Storm dragons). Orphiel defects or whatever when he's sent to our universe to pave the way, doesn't have faith in the 5-god Vigil's plan (feels it isn't enough) and decides to create his own to supplement theirs. As it says in many places around Defiant lore: many Defiant scholars have no problem with the gods of the Vigil; they just don't feel they are ENOUGH (in those texts, it was usually referring to them not being enough to stop the dragons of the Blood Storm, but it could apply here as well). Aia (Fate) feels not only spited, but like they are actually going to cause more harm than good, so decides to release the monsters the previously-united Vigil had imprisoned, hence the arrival of the Akvan.

    A whole lotta guess-work there, but it ends up making some valid connections. We just don't know WHY Orphiel did what he did. If he even did it. Lol.

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    Also, I'm remembering Vanilla lore again. Something about the Vigil no longer being separate gods when they "became" the Vigil. They used to be their own, totally separate entities, but they joined together to become the Vigil when the threat of the Blood Storm became apparent.

    http://rift.zam.com/wiki/The_Theolog...28Rift_Lore%29

    How they joined together is never really explained. Are they 5 but united in purpose? Did they give up their individuality and become a single entity?

    At this point, it may turn out to be moot. The last time the Vigil was heard from was right before the Ward was erected around Telara. The Ward seemed to cut them off just as surely as it did the elemental planes.. The Ward has been breached, though, which is what allows the rifts to invade, so if they wanted to communicate with mortals again, they theoretically could.

    Their messengers still carry messages to mortals, like when the Guardian leadership is getting all up in arms about Empyreal technology early in the Guardian quest line in SL, and one of their "angels" appears to give their input on the subject. Who sent the messenger? Do they act on behalf of the Vigil directly? Did the Vigil see that event happening and dispatch that specific messenger? Or are the messengers just around, carrying out the Vigil's pre-set policies?

    It feels to me like something about creating the Ward significantly weakened the Vigil, maybe to such an extent that they can't recover and may never be a major force again. They might also have faced other threats while the Ward was up around Telara that we have no idea exists because they never appeared on Telara. Or, they might have just learned or decided that it's best to take a more indirect approach. Funny, since Aia started out trying to be very indirect, and is now becoming more and more direct in her attempts to kill us.

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    This is great, thanks a lot.
    So I was completely off with the Pallas and co. being the vigil, was just confused as to why Aia, Goddess of Fate and Pallas and co. were in the same quest.

    So I wanted to ask, because I thought Tenebrean's were actually the "original ascended", with Samekh clearly being an ascended and a Tenebrean (I think...), might have got that completely mixed up. So I was also curious about Samekh, we don't actually kill her in the chronicle, she is obviously going to pop up again, any hints as to where that might be? Also Samekh saying "This is not how you kill an ascended" soo... How exactly "do" you kill an ascended if it's not "nuke it"? Is it said somewhere?

    Thanks again, much appreciated.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ImJosh View Post
    This is great, thanks a lot.
    So I was completely off with the Pallas and co. being the vigil, was just confused as to why Aia, Goddess of Fate and Pallas and co. were in the same quest.

    So I wanted to ask, because I thought Tenebrean's were actually the "original ascended", with Samekh clearly being an ascended and a Tenebrean (I think...), might have got that completely mixed up. So I was also curious about Samekh, we don't actually kill her in the chronicle, she is obviously going to pop up again, any hints as to where that might be? Also Samekh saying "This is not how you kill an ascended" soo... How exactly "do" you kill an ascended if it's not "nuke it"? Is it said somewhere?

    Thanks again, much appreciated.
    I don't think we've been given any clues as to where we'll encounter her again. Maybe another 5-man instance or raid later on in the game.

    In terms of killing Ascended... YOU'RE an Ascended. You can die, but you'll just resurrect. I think that's what she's referring to. Somewhere in one of the newbie areas it's actually explained that Ascended are technically immortal because they can die but will come back. They already came back once, after all.

    The idea that we're gonna find out how to permanently kill an Ascended being in this expansion is kinda creepy, because that means it should work on us, too.

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    Also another thought came to mind, Drekanoth of Fate, ascended kill him in Rhen of Fate, yet that is a silver, so the Drekanoth of Fate is still alive? Also why do we kill him in Rhen of Fate? What is the association there? Would it not make sense if we killing him in Mount Sharax? Keeping in mind I haven't actually done the raid at all yet so I haven't seen the dialogue.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ImJosh View Post
    Also another thought came to mind, Drekanoth of Fate, ascended kill him in Rhen of Fate, yet that is a silver, so the Drekanoth of Fate is still alive? Also why do we kill him in Rhen of Fate? What is the association there? Would it not make sense if we killing him in Mount Sharax? Keeping in mind I haven't actually done the raid at all yet so I haven't seen the dialogue.
    Rhen and Drekanoth are just titles, for all we know, he was replaced.

    Also, the way slivers work, is that they are an alternate timeline, or what could have been, or a different dimension where something different occurred.
    Which sounds neat, until you do the chronicle with Laethys in which it states, very clearly, that she was about to enter our dimension to try and take over, our dimension where she was already dead.
    It flat out opened the doors for all of our enemies being dead, and all of them being still alive too. lol

    So technically because they wrote it, Regulos could come back again, even in dragon form.
    Maelforge could come back, any of them could come back and not just recreations from Arak.
    It kind of broke the universe, lol, but it's in the game so...

    When you write a world with multi-demensions, string theory concepts, connected multiverses and time travel, basically anything is possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hardy83 View Post
    Rhen and Drekanoth are just titles, for all we know, he was replaced.

    Also, the way slivers work, is that they are an alternate timeline, or what could have been, or a different dimension where something different occurred.
    Which sounds neat, until you do the chronicle with Laethys in which it states, very clearly, that she was about to enter our dimension to try and take over, our dimension where she was already dead.
    It flat out opened the doors for all of our enemies being dead, and all of them being still alive too. lol

    So technically because they wrote it, Regulos could come back again, even in dragon form.
    Maelforge could come back, any of them could come back and not just recreations from Arak.
    It kind of broke the universe, lol, but it's in the game so...

    When you write a world with multi-demensions, string theory concepts, connected multiverses and time travel, basically anything is possible.
    Yeah, I've always found it weird that the slivers were the premise of so many of their raids. The content is fun, but it does make anything possible, and sometimes I almost feel like they are doing it so recycle content, even if the content is new. Maybe "recycle lore" is a better description there, except it is technically new lore, just a retcon for that specific universe...

    Anywho, reading your comment got me thinking. What if the Tenebreans are from an alternate Telara? One where Asha Catari, Kaspar, and that other guy who is with the Tenebreans but whose name I can't remember, are actually alive, the dragons haven't won, because the Tenebreans (rather than the Guardians or Defiants; it's just a "faction" name) beat them. Those characters actually ARE Asha, Kaspar, and 3rd dude, but they have different names because the universe they come from gave them different names. It could explain why they have Ascended: the Eth in that universe succeeded in their Life Forges, the Convocation never destroyed Eth society; in fact, it made it even stronger. The Guardians were never created, because the Tenebreans saved Telara, and because of their power, they went on to conquer their versions of the Planes, and then other universes because they were bored. Could explain why Orphiel was so attached to Eth culture in our Telara: he knew it was the key, because he'd seen it happen in his own world. But his philosophy was different than the other Tenebreans, in that he believed in the freedom to create and explore technology to build culture, not just to conquer. His naming of the Defiants could have a double-meaning there too: Defiant against the Vigil, Defiant against the Tenebreans.

    Now, I know that an alternate universe THAT different from our own probably WOULDN'T have Asha and Kaspar and other similar characters because they are kinda a product of the events in our universe, but it's still a really fun thought.

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    Forgot to mention in above post : and it would explain the re-use of major-player character textures.
    Last edited by dannuck; 12-06-2014 at 12:46 PM.

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    Yes, more than likely slivers were made to recycle content and whip out fast raids and chronicles.

    And yes, it would be an interesting idea the Tenebreans are just Ascended from another universe. It's crossed my mind.
    I mean in a recent livestream, CaptainCursor did state they have some ideas for making PvP interesting in terms of lore, so it's quite possible they are going this route. Or at least make PvP justified since really right now there's no reason for Guardians and Ascended to be fighting each other.
    The Warrior Liberator soul reveal was also just about conquest and Ascended fighting ascended but reasons that weren't disclosed.

    Maybe he's going to push the multiverse theory to the limit. lol

    An idea, we'll see. :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by dannuck View Post
    Forgot to mention in above post : and it would explain the re-use of major-player character textures.
    Nah, you'll notice re-using textures is just a Trion specialty, none of the planar invaders in NT aside bosses are really new, and even with bosses the non-Planar Fortress events are basically re-used as well. But they did finally re-use the Murdantix texture for a death invasion!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ImJosh View Post
    This is great, thanks a lot.
    So I was completely off with the Pallas and co. being the vigil, was just confused as to why Aia, Goddess of Fate and Pallas and co. were in the same quest.

    So I wanted to ask, because I thought Tenebrean's were actually the "original ascended", with Samekh clearly being an ascended and a Tenebrean (I think...), might have got that completely mixed up. So I was also curious about Samekh, we don't actually kill her in the chronicle, she is obviously going to pop up again, any hints as to where that might be? Also Samekh saying "This is not how you kill an ascended" soo... How exactly "do" you kill an ascended if it's not "nuke it"? Is it said somewhere?

    Thanks again, much appreciated.
    Crucia's Tempest Engine seems to have perma-killed a lot of Ascended in TB, based on the dialogue and tone of voice from Miela, but the actual design of the Tempest Engine was never really explained, closest guess I had was that it's a really big storm cannon. And what about Abominus? Would that have killed all the Ascended too? Were it's abilities even explained? Stuff like Aia, Tenebreans, Orphiel etc. may see a future more complex story by Trion (where majority of RIFT 1 devs have left so I assumed they didn't care for lore) now, but I wouldn't bet the Engine and Abominus are ever gonna get explained. Though the Architect Hive is clearly still active judging from Project Plane Crawler I guess, and Crucia and her Storm Legion aren't so dead anymore it seems.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cookiez217 View Post
    Crucia's Tempest Engine seems to have perma-killed a lot of Ascended in TB, based on the dialogue and tone of voice from Miela, but the actual design of the Tempest Engine was never really explained, closest guess I had was that it's a really big storm cannon. And what about Abominus? Would that have killed all the Ascended too? Were it's abilities even explained? Stuff like Aia, Tenebreans, Orphiel etc. may see a future more complex story by Trion (where majority of RIFT 1 devs have left so I assumed they didn't care for lore) now, but I wouldn't bet the Engine and Abominus are ever gonna get explained. Though the Architect Hive is clearly still active judging from Project Plane Crawler I guess, and Crucia and her Storm Legion aren't so dead anymore it seems.
    Pretty sure captaincursor, the head of the lore has been on Rift since the start.

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