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Thread: mathosia starting area

  1. #1
    Rift Chaser
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    Default mathosia starting area

    I know the guardians and the defiant are out to defeat regulos. but in mathosia starting area, i see the defiant techs use morbid imfusers on mathosian citizens. why is the defiant helping the mathosian tyrant, king Alexicus when the king made a pact with regulos?

  2. #2
    Plane Walker Xerokine's Avatar
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    Two reasons.

    First, Aedraxis originally had Bahmi and Eth join his forces by promising that he'd remove the laws against magitech. This was back when no one knew he was dealing with Regulos, and everyone assumed Zareph was just an upstart rebel trying to steal the throne.

    Second, you see Defiants later in the starting more, most notably during that last rift, who scream about how they cannot control their bodies. This, combined with Death's natural tendency to corrupt people's souls - see Eliam in X-RD - led to the Defiants doing things they wouldn't normally do.
    "I get up early. And I don't go to bed until I've made some very poor decisions."

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    Ascendant Maeloda's Avatar
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    The Defiants (Eth and Bahmi, since the Kelari don't join until yearrrrss later) didn't put up protections against the corruptive Death energies that Aedraxis likely gave them. They were foolish, at least in the eyes of the Guardians, to have embraced magitech and open themselves up to Death.

    But as a Guardian, we don't care why they are killing people - they simply took up heretical beliefs and must pay . Personally, I'd rather purify or detain any Defiant, but silly Jebiah told me to KILL THEM ALL.

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    It's all point of view as well. We're told they are all working with Regulos, but we don't hear from the other side to know if THEY know that, or are they just following their orders, blind to what is really going on.

    Then again, after they opened the rift, they would have known.. they would be dead like the rest of us, but they would have known at that point.

  5. #5
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    After the Eye of Regulos opened, the surge of death energy (later known as the Shade) corrupted them. Corruption in Rift isn't like corruption in - say - Star Wars or WoW. It isn't a slippery slope, though it begin that way. It's more like a disease. You can get stuck with a rusty needle and catch corruption. Considering they were at the epicenter of the Shade, everybody there who wasn't instantly killed was corrupted.

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    The truth is we dont exactly know why the defiants are still helping Andrexis at that point. I do remember on of the defiant npcs saying something about it being horrible work but neccesary to getting their own land. It was the defaint guy running around checking the machines.

    Its hard to call exactly what had happened to them. I get the feeling the ones closest to the rift basicly became undead. However there were alot including Orpheal that were not undead and yet seemed to still be working for Andrexis and against Zareph and the Guardians even after the shade with rampent death energy spillling out everywhere.

    Perhaps they were corrupted by the death energy but what happened to them afterward? They just got better? We see no sign of them among the Endless Court. Were they the Defiants that Orpheal followed back to Zareph? When did the corruption fade from them? How did it fade?

    Corruption is a viable possiblity but there isnt much supporting evidence. Im somewhat incline to lead toward human failability myself. They didnt want to see what was happening cause they wanted the future they dreamed of that much. Humans are very good at deluding themselves. (Note, thats all humans. Im not saying this is a defiant thing. Its just part of human nature.)

    What would have been interesting is if we met a Defiant in Stillmoor who was there trying to atone for his part in aiding Andrexis. That would have been an interesting story. Would have also perhaps painted how the Defiants had changed over time and maybe gotten a bit wiser.

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    Plane Walker Xerokine's Avatar
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    Strictly speaking, they weren't Defiant at that point. They were just some Ethians and some Bahmi who joined Aedraxis because he promised to overturn the laws against magitech. We also have at least one artifact collection on the subject here;

    "This book describes the regret of the Eth who signed on to fight with Aedraxis in his war against his brother. Seeking to restore their kingdom, they instead unknowingly aided in the release of Regulos."
    "I get up early. And I don't go to bed until I've made some very poor decisions."

    *Antaeus, Defiant Kelari - Faeblight RP-PvE
    Now available: Telara, as seen through screenshots of varying quality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xerokine View Post
    Strictly speaking, they weren't Defiant at that point. They were just some Ethians and some Bahmi who joined Aedraxis because he promised to overturn the laws against magitech. We also have at least one artifact collection on the subject here;

    "This book describes the regret of the Eth who signed on to fight with Aedraxis in his war against his brother. Seeking to restore their kingdom, they instead unknowingly aided in the release of Regulos."
    Well strickly speaking thats true. My comments come from the fact all the mobs in the starting area have Defiant in their name. For that matter the Defiants first formed around Orpheal so many of the survivors from that battle may have been the first core of what would become the defiants.

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    Rift Disciple Hawkeyez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xerokine View Post
    Strictly speaking, they weren't Defiant at that point. They were just some Ethians and some Bahmi who joined Aedraxis because he promised to overturn the laws against magitech. We also have at least one artifact collection on the subject here;

    "This book describes the regret of the Eth who signed on to fight with Aedraxis in his war against his brother. Seeking to restore their kingdom, they instead unknowingly aided in the release of Regulos."
    Just because it was a faction of the Defiant, and not the whole, doesn't divorce them from the Defiant-label: nor absolve the Defiant for not controlling/preventing those who aided Aedraxis. After all, none of the Defiant stood up on the side of the Vigil to stop these "rogue" Defiant from doing their awful deeds: at least not until after it was clear that Regulos was the one controlling everything through his Aedraxis-avatar and, thus, too late to stop. So, strictly speaking yes, they were the Defiant. Later regret doesn't wash away the deed: murder someone, and later regret does not remove you from being a murderer.
    Last edited by Hawkeyez; 11-07-2011 at 10:03 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeyez View Post
    Just because it was a faction of the Defiant, and not the whole, doesn't divorce them from the Defiant-label: nor absolve the Defiant for not controlling/preventing those who aided Aedraxis. After all, none of the Defiant stood up on the side of the Vigil to stop these "rogue" Defiant from doing their awful deeds: at least not until after it was clear that Regulos was the one controlling everything through his Aedraxis-avatar and, thus, too late to stop. So, strictly speaking yes, they were the Defiant. Later regret doesn't wash away the deed: murder someone, and later regret does not remove you from being a murderer.
    No, he means that the Defiants were not a legitimate political entity until either the restructuring of Port Scion, or the fall of Port Scion. The Guardians were created the very moment the Mathosian Empire fell with the coming of the Shade, but they existed unopposed until much later.

  11. #11
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    This is something that's bothered me. I'm not sure if I'm just missing something or the lore is contradicting itself a little bit here.

    I thought the Defiant organization didn't even exist until after the fall of Port Scion. But in the Guardian starter area the Eth and Bahmi siding with Aedraxis are openly referred to as Defiants by the NPCs. It's... confusing.

    It was just Orphiel and some groups of Eth and Bahmi who had joined Aedraxis. Thanks to the promise of being granted land, the removal of laws against Magitech and, of course, the commonly held belief that Zareph was just trying to usurp his older brother's power.

    Even later when Orphiel led the Eth and Bahmi to reinforce Zareph and the Guardians at Port Scion I didn't think they called themselves Defiants.

    I don't know maybe I've totally misunderstood something somewhere.
    Last edited by Kedon; 11-07-2011 at 11:42 AM.

  12. #12
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    I dont think the Defiants became a strictly organised group till later. At that point I think the name probably just refered to a group of poeple who were actively persuing free use of magitech. Orpheal was the founder of the Defiants so its likely some of that group became the core of the organisation you have today.

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    thank you all your views. it is quite interesting storyline.

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    Plane Walker Enaki's Avatar
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    I see two possibilities here:

    1. "Defiant" in the past was used the same way we would use the words renegade, rogue. Less of an indication of political affiliation and rather an indication of going against "the law".
    2. "Defiant" could be the Dev's realizing that the first time through the game you have no idea of the "current day" structures and threw the name in just to make sure people connected group A with group B, even if they was not quite a direct line between them.

    I'm guessing that the real reason is 2 and 1 is the convenient justification for it.
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  15. #15
    Plane Walker Xerokine's Avatar
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    'Defiant' was originally a slang term used by Mathosians to refer to the 'heretical' races; those who 'defied' the Vigil. Specifically, the Eth and Bahmi, as the Kelari really didn't venture off the Ember Isles that much. The term wasn't used as an actual, official organization until after the fall of Port Scion, where the formerly united forces until King Zareph split into the faithful, led by Cyril, who dubbed themselves 'Guardians', and the heretical, led by Orphiel, who used the term 'Defiant'.
    "I get up early. And I don't go to bed until I've made some very poor decisions."

    *Antaeus, Defiant Kelari - Faeblight RP-PvE
    Now available: Telara, as seen through screenshots of varying quality.

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