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Thread: [Lore] Racial Factions - Why?

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple Nativus's Avatar
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    Default [Lore] Racial Factions - Why?

    Before I start I'd like to say I like lore of RIFT to a degree, it's interesting, even if a totally new IP, but I feel you've fallen into the "accepted" MMO tropes when it comes to factions.

    From the very start I liked the idea of two competing ideologies, rather then the more traditional national or allied forces, but I feel the idea of splitting the factions by race has undermined it somewhat.

    Having the Eth and Mathosian (sp?) being both humans, just from different cultures was pretty good, but why bother having faction split races, with the dwarfs and elfs on one side, and the "dark elves" and "big dudes" on the other.

    The defiants work alongside Dwarfs all the time, and if you look at the story-line and lore by itself, it's clear that defiants and guardians are more political groups then national ones.

    It somewhat makes sense in games like World of Warcraft (I know I went there) where it's basically two massive confederations fighting each other, but RIFT is about the ideological difference between the two factions, so it would make more sense if the races were more like older MMOs like Anarchy Online where any race can belong too any faction, because it's about what you believe rather then what race you are. It might even make the more game much more interesting, because let's face it, the "good guy" / "bad guy" (even if in RIFT that is really hard to define) MMO factions have gotten really stale.

    I know it's too late to change it in game drastically, but it makes sense that players can't be a Dwarf Defiant, or a Eth Guardian. Perhaps a new future "mini-purchase" future like the spider-mount pack could unlock the other side's races for both factions. I'd pay $10 for that.

  2. #2
    Ascendant TheDrizzle404's Avatar
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    ive often wondered why mmos do that as well. id just as soon make every race available and make them choose a faction, just like what would really happen.

  3. #3
    General of Telara
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    I'm guessing the story writers assumes that every single member of a race will always have close enough beliefs to end up on the same side of the conflict

    Or they just had to deal with it after some game designer told them he didn't give a crap about that and just wanted the two faction to look different enough!

  4. #4
    Soulwalker
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    This is one of the few things you can actually blame on WOW. I'd much rather see a modern mmo that has its pvp conflicts as a guild vs guild affair or at the very least do 3 sides like DAOC.

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    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoshix View Post
    answer is no dwarfs allowed in Meridian, EVER
    fixed it for you Yoshix


    Den of Madness | Greybriar | Den of Badness | Derpwood

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoshix View Post
    answer is no
    A well-written article on whether or not you support one side or the other, and more importantly, why.

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    Ascendant Noaani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoshix View Post
    answer is no
    Your last 25 or so posts (probably more, that's just where I stopped counting) have been no more than maybe 5 or 6 words.

    Try saying something intelligent (and try using capitalisation and punctuation).

    If the answer is no, explain why this is the case.
    Quote Originally Posted by Debase View Post
    If the only target audience for Rift is disenfranchised WoW players, its doomed imo.

  8. #8
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    The Defiant are all members of races that rejected or were rejected by the Vigil - the Eth and Kelari turned to their magitech and spirits respectively, each turning away from the Vigil, and the Bahmi resulted from breeding between the Shalastiri (from the Plane of Air, which sets the Vigil against them) and the Eth. Possibly the Bahmi ancestor worship has also influenced it, but I believe the planetouched and Ethian ties started it.

    By comparison, each of the Guardian races were originally patroned by a god of the Vigil. Thedeor patroned the Mathosians, Tavril the High Elves and Bahralt the Dwarves.

    As to why there are no Defiant Ascended from the Guardian races? We can certainly have Defiant non-Ascended from them. In Terminus, we see the technicians scanning the Soulstream and rejecting souls with Guardian leanings, so it's possible they simply don't bother to check certain races who would have a high percentage of Vigil followers.
    Last edited by Akyaevin; 10-27-2011 at 03:25 AM.

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    Rift Disciple Nativus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antipiety View Post
    This is one of the few things you can actually blame on WOW. I'd much rather see a modern mmo that has its pvp conflicts as a guild vs guild affair or at the very least do 3 sides like DAOC.
    AO did it with 3 sides as well, did it rather well actually. There was Omnitech, a mega corp that "claimed" the planet it was set on. Then there were the Clans, descendants of Omni workers who rebelled who wanted to rule themselves, and the Neutrals (my personal favourite faction) that was caught between them and just wish both sides would go away so they could get on with life.

    When you started out you chose your race, class, etc. and were sent down the planet, from there you could either chose to become Omni or Clan right off the bat, or you could enter the Neutral (who could team with either faction, who couldn't team with each other) starting zone until you figured out where you belonged, with the option to join a faction whenever you wanted up to the (pre-expansion) max level, there were even items that allowed you to "defect" to the other side.

    The game had a lot of flaws, but the faction system wasn't one of them (until they went the WoW path and locked everyone in)

    I really don't like this tendency towards "well we've gotta have 2 factions with each having their own races" that MMOs are heading towards. I'd like to see faction-less (where people split up based on guilds/etc to fight) or 3+ factions. Old MMOs had a lot of flaws, but that wasn't one of them.

  10. #10
    Plane Touched
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    Erm, visual differences are important between opposing factions of course. Race is the easiest way to achieve this.

    Stop looking so deep, the simplest explanation is almost always the correct one.

  11. #11
    Telaran Corinne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noaani View Post
    Your last 25 or so posts (probably more, that's just where I stopped counting) have been no more than maybe 5 or 6 words.

    Try saying something intelligent (and try using capitalisation and punctuation).

    If the answer is no, explain why this is the case.
    LOL, you guys can't recognise a troll if you trip over one!

  12. #12
    Rift Disciple Nativus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BusyHandz View Post
    Erm, visual differences are important between opposing factions of course. Race is the easiest way to achieve this.

    Stop looking so deep, the simplest explanation is almost always the correct one.
    The two human races can't be told apart at a glance, neither can the elves, so that leaves the dwarfs and the big blue dudes.

    Race might be an easy way to do it, it's also lazy.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corinne View Post
    LOL, you guys can't recognise a troll if you trip over one!
    I dont even look anymore I know who it is, and skip it. Hes like a bot to me now.
    Last edited by synrgy; 10-27-2011 at 04:37 AM.

  14. #14
    Ascendant Noaani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BusyHandz View Post
    Erm, visual differences are important between opposing factions of course. Race is the easiest way to achieve this.

    Stop looking so deep, the simplest explanation is almost always the correct one.
    Actually, clothing makes far more of an impact in the way we look than race does.
    Quote Originally Posted by Debase View Post
    If the only target audience for Rift is disenfranchised WoW players, its doomed imo.

  15. #15
    RIFT Community Ambassador Morvick's Avatar
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    The basic concept is that while many (and any) member of a Race can choose what they believe, we are told at the beginning of the game "Ignore them. You're playing an ex-Hammerknell Dwarf who believes the Gods are worth worshiping." or "We know there are other factions of Bahmi and Eth, but the ones you are going to play will be those who would die for Magitech." It's like in America, the mainstream news will either ignore anything that is not Democrat or Republican, or force-categorize/falsely label a group into one of those two political factions. For many Defiants, anyone who doesn't believe Magitech is answer is seen as an obstacle to be removed or used; likewise any Non-Guardian faction is a potential convert or conquest to your average Vigil-worshiping Faithful.

    The other fractal races' factions exist, mostly as the Neutral Factions who you need to gain Rep with. Unfortunately, we are not to play those people. I'd also prefer a different system, but until then, well...
    Live gloriously! Die heroically!

    And if you don't roleplay or really care then it boils down to PvP, which is why the faction divide exists anyway.
    Last edited by Morvick; 10-27-2011 at 06:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zinbik View Post
    I also made other enhancements to certain aspects of the game for various reasons.

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