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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: The Darkest Magic - Requested/Suggested Change

  1. #1
    Ascendant Solaxys's Avatar
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    Default The Darkest Magic - Requested/Suggested Change

    The popularity of Sea of Ladon as the go-to Raid Rift for the weekly campaign or essence farming is insurmountable. It takes roughly ~10-15 minutes to fill a raid of twenty for this particular raid rift even at the wee hours of reset, while both Planecrawler Project and The Darkest Magic take ~20-30 minutes to fill at primetime. It is rather impossible to even account for any repeat sessions of these two raid rifts in comparison to the water one.

    These statistics do not take the DRR rotation into account. They are for NA only. Some bias .

    I do not mind (or truly care) for PP being ignored by the populus, as it shares the same loot table as the other two RRs, however TDM needs to be looked into. It is the only raid rift that drops BiS Raid-Tier Earrings. And as someone who wants to min-max their character, it is rather aggravating to deal with the uphill of recruiting (outside of when it is DRR) for this particular raid rift when no one prefers or commits to do it.

    Why is this the case?
    Two part answer:
    1. Ease
    SoL has been heavily gutted since its release (ah, the days of Slibberjack and Shockbite together). It does not depend, these days, on competent players as much as the turrets and the flokum. You can have everyone but one person die and the RR can still be conquered. It can be completed quickly and effortlessly, and dare I say, mindlessly.

    In comparison, TDM takes more coordination, individual awareness and competence, and eats at least 20+ minutes at the bare minimum. More often than naught, we have to have a VoiP to organize and raid-lead this raid rift. Furthermore, this RR is the pinnacle of enabling "grief"; take for instance that I choose to kick someone for misdemeanor or ineffective game-play, they can activate multiple bunnies in P2, summon more adds than needed in P3, pre-activate/waste the white "cleanse" zones in P4, or interrupt lesser evil in P5, all leading to increased difficulty of completing the raid rift (or, you know, wiping).

    It is of no surprise then that there is at least 3 groups of SoL running during peak hours and at least 20 being attempted on a daily basis, while barely 2-4 per week, if at all, of TDM. Particularly when...

    2. How Loot is Managed
    Assuming one braves through the aforementioned troubles of TDM, they are not guaranteed an earring (of any sort, let alone one that applies to them). There is more of a chance that essences - yes the exact some ones that drop from the other two RRs - will find their way into the chest(s).

    Yet again, people would choose SoL over TDM.

    Rift does not host the population anymore that wants to rigorously grind content for such a small (seemingly insignificant) upgrade, especially considering how watered down minute stat gains are to the overall picture. However, some of us still want it.

    Thus I Propose
    Either or (don't induce both changes, for the love of God)
    1. Gut the mechanics
    P1: Increase the timer of yellow bubble warning (by 1s at a minimum) so we actually don't need movement speed from bard to successfully make it from point 0 to point 2+radius (since the AoE is larger than the graphic).

    P2: Make it consistently spawn two bunnies rather than 0 or 3, and same change as above. Or, you know, remove this phase.

    P3: Reduce the AoE damage output from Green by a tad or reduce the combined AoE damage from the firestorm and missed-green together.
    Reduce the damage by the adds on the tank.
    Also, reduce the range of the AoE damage in relation to the boss (i.e. if someone has respawned and running back, give them a grace period before the AoE ticks as usually, depending on where they respawn, it hits twice and kills them before they have a chance to get to the safe color.)

    P4: Nothing, it is fine as it is. (Though I suppose reducing the damage on tank when polyp heads are trigger-happily-cleaved by PuGs might limit the stress)

    P5: Increase the duration of subsequent casts of Lights Out and make it consistent (sometimes its very short [~5s], other times it takes nearly 40s before we see another Lights Out) -- ~12-15s between each cast seems solid.
    Increase the time to run out of white AoE (Again ~1s should be enough)

    P6: Remove the blink-cleave mechanic (1. It is incredibly hard to predict when you have everything else going on that clog your screen. 2. The range of the cone horizontally is MUCH larger than the gfx indicates. 3. It usually follows up with isolation instantaneously).
    Reduce health of adds OR make the boss stay in stasis until the adds are all dead.
    Reduce the spawn amount or clutter frequency of storms.

    2. Improve Loot Management
    Or keep the mechanics as they are and
    Condense the loot table of the 2nd chest to only include raid earrings.
    Alternatively, make it share the loot table with raid earrings and greaters (induce whatever RNG ratio to keep the game in balance)

    Either of these changes can help with getting more people actively doing this raid rift, though the 2nd option is the more tantalizing one.

    ===
    TL;DR: Nerf TDM or make sure the 2nd chest always nets a raid earring.
    ** This is with the general Rift playerbase in mind, not just the "l33t" guilds, so keep the "omg its so easy" comments out of it.

    Thanks!
    Last edited by Solaxys; 03-22-2015 at 01:37 PM.

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    Thanks for the feedback. I've been thinking about ways to reduce the difficulty of TDM, so specific suggestions like these are useful.

    Cheers!

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    I often run these with pugs and I dont have any real issue with them aside from stage 4 and 5 lasting long. I have to say though that I do require people to come on ts and we do stage 5 by using life insurance (physician cooldown) on the green circles instead of running together. And on stage 4 the shadow smite mechanic is often killing people unless we actually have a good phys or puri to shield whoever it goes on.

    The second part of stage one with the 10 bunnies is kind of weird though as Solaxys said, we try to kill the bunnies as fast as possible and then you generally get none of them to actually become active. However if youre a little slow it can happen that youre fighting 2 bunnies at the same time which means you need to wipe and then pull them one by one.
    Last edited by ttlyevil; 03-23-2015 at 10:10 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solaxys View Post
    In comparison, TDM takes more coordination, individual awareness and competence, and eats at least 20+ minutes at the bare minimum. More often than naught, we have to have a VoiP to organize and raid-lead this raid rift.
    Quote Originally Posted by ttlyevil View Post
    I have to say though that I do require people to come on ts and we do stage 5 by using life insurance (physician cooldown) on the green circles instead of running together.
    This is the common problem with TDM, needing voice comms. DRR's, since they are supposed to be designed as a daily quest, should be able to be completed by PUG groups without needing voice comms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wali View Post
    This is the common problem with TDM, needing voice comms. DRR's, since they are supposed to be designed as a daily quest, should be able to be completed by PUG groups without needing voice comms.
    Theres a guy on EU running them without voice comm. He opens them in a spot where respawn is super close so it basicly doesnt matter if someone dies every now and then. Like on the green circles on stage 5 he just lets people die. It works just fine but it takes long.
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    I realize this thread is specifically for The Darkest Magic rift, but on a somewhat related note I would also like to see some changes made to Planecrawler Project. in its current state it is completely not worth doing or even buying lures for it.

    it needs to be either toned down significantly to be on par with Sea of Ladon, or have its rewards increased according to the difficulty curve.

    The particular PUG wiping/killing mechanics seem to be as follows:

    1. The black fire thing under players is not distinct enough and too quick. Players trying to run from it often times kill the tank, tank healer, or dom reflector causing a wipe.

    2. the black fire thing can wipe the raid when it gets on the tank healer as often times he/she has no good place left to run and is unable to fully keep the tank up while on the move (some specs have it easier then others).

    3. the reflect mechanic needs to be more plain and apparent and have a longer warning. PUGs tend to not only run without voice coms, but also without kalerts, KBM, default UI, etc. The default warnings for this mechanic are completely inadequate.

    4. the shielding LOS issue. I don't know if this is intended or bugged, if its intended it also needs to be looked at, as many pugs wipe due to not receiving heals after being chased by the above mentioned black (flames?) things and end up being LOS of raid / tank heals and dying.


    Inb4: but i know someone that does it .....

    That someone is not indicative of average rift PUG raid and is an exception. I have done it too as part of the organizer team, but only for novelty / curiosity. I do not intend to do this rift again unless it is either changed or its rewards are worth my time and effort.

    I would say also that it would be nice to have an equivalent of SH62s in NTE, those were a blast, better then the current raid rifts and nightmare rifts combined. And you already have a SH structure in place, in Goboro reef, one of the adventures on the coast you have to jump on pads to retrieve stuff, you could use that structure to save some design time.

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    Ascendant Solaxys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ttlyevil View Post
    Theres a guy on EU running them without voice comm. He opens them in a spot where respawn is super close so it basicly doesnt matter if someone dies every now and then. Like on the green circles on stage 5 he just lets people die. It works just fine but it takes long.
    Pretty much.
    I did 3 earlier today with V-com, and each took ~24 mins; spent more time recruiting than doing them.
    Then I did 1 without V-com, and that roughly took 43 mins, especially the last phases going 10 mins each.

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    Quote Originally Posted by krug View Post
    Thanks for the feedback. I've been thinking about ways to reduce the difficulty of TDM, so specific suggestions like these are useful.

    Cheers!
    I do agrees that the drop chance for earring should be increased, not necessary 100% but at least to 20% or so, during the release of TDM till now i havent see a single drop in earings yet, or increased the chances of greaters as well.

    Some of the phase changes that i think should be thinked is that:

    P1: This phase seems fine to be, the first yellow bubble comes fast, so people just got spread out fast, in terms of difficulties, this drr should be harder comparing to others afterall.

    P2: This phase, out of the 10 rabbits, randomly sometimes all of those are fake, sometimes there is 1 real one, sometimes there is 2, honestly i think this shouldnt be based on RNG, but something more consistent as Solaxys suggests, or have some sort of mechanics here or something similar.

    P3: Exploit Alert? There is a Problem is this phase as since adds hit quite hard, as a result of that i have seen people(at least 3 times now) by mis-using the BLUE circle buffs that grants BONUS DMG/HEALS, people are only switching circle between 2 blue circles and completely ignoring any other circle/mechanics, so what i suggests is that REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF DMG/HEAL BONUS from blue circle, reduce other aoe damage and as well as slightly reduce the damage of adds, so that raid will have to focus adds down first before turning to boss again, of course more adds lets say 5 will still be able to take tanks down eventually, so this should grab the attention of dpsers that more adds ARE a problem and we cant use blue circles consistently.

    P4: So far seems fine to me, no changes necessary.

    P5: Either boss's hp is a lot or Lights Out is too frequent, either reduce boss's hp or let boss casts Lights Out less frequent. White aoe time yes, should be increased by another second or so, aoe silences people too fast.

    P6: The cone is large but shouldnt be a problem to dodge, but yes make the cone match the GFX, we cant have a cone that hit half of combat area. The dps requirement for adds are quite high, if this DRR was intend for t1 raid geared people than its fine but i dont think its the case here, reduce adds hp should be fine(so that normal expert geared people can still dps down the adds just before this statis phase ends), boss stays statis till adds gone is a No, if its like that, then there is no point in this phase. The spreading out red aoe may be hitting too hard, its a instant death when 2 people are together, but yeah thats the mechanic afterall.

    PS: Always a earing in the 2nd chest may be too much, that way people is just gona farm it everyday.., but surely increase the drop rate will be a good idea.
    PS: One my guild member has said that my guild have did this 10 times, and 9 of those 10 times droped earings, so im not sure what is wrong with this drop rate, or is it related to that more guild members = higher drop rate?
    Last edited by MisakaMikoto; 03-24-2015 at 12:47 AM.
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    I think it's fine how it is and encourages people to learn to be better at playing this game.

    OP's argument here is that it drops BIS earrings, so he should be able to pug it easily whenver it's the daily.

    Shall we suggest reducing the difficulty of the new raid as well using the same argument? Why not just give a BIS piece in the daily box, nice and easy.

    Only thing I can suggest doing to make it more PUG friendly (as a person who leads PUGS of this RR) is to add mechanic similar to the nightmare rift Junctions that give you a chance between stages that have timers to explain the next fight without wasting valuable time on said timer. If you want to go all out and make it even more pug friendly, give the adds on the final stage unique names so that focus targetting macros can be made for interrupts.

    P3: Exploit Alert? There is a Problem is this phase as since adds hit quite hard, as a result of that i have seen people(at least 3 times now) by mis-using the BLUE circle buffs that grants BONUS DMG/HEALS, people are only switching circle between 2 blue circles and completely ignoring any other circle/mechanics, so what i suggests is that REDUCE THE AMOUNT OF DMG/HEAL BONUS from blue circle, reduce other aoe damage and as well as slightly reduce the damage of adds, so that raid will have to focus adds down first before turning to boss again, of course more adds lets say 5 will still be able to take tanks down eventually, so this should grab the attention of dpsers that more adds ARE a problem and we cant use blue circles consistently.
    Not really a bug exploit imo, this can definitely be chalked up to clever use of game mechanics. If the devs didn't intend for the strategy of constantly using the blue buff to work, they could simply make it give you a debuff when the boss isn't blue. In PUGs adds come out anyway and they are trivial to deal with, especially if you have reavers in the raid. If you don't have a reaver, having a couple mages go stormcaller or a couple rogues go sabo takes care of the adds entirely, probably even just one would do since defilers do a ton of aoe damage on that stage. IMO the fight is actually easier if you just match the colors (although most likely it will take slightly longer, due to obvious reasons), the issue is getting 19 random other people to do the same.

    Speaking of bugs, the first time I got to stage 5 on this fight I'm fairly certain we encountered a bug. The timer ran out on the stage, yet the rift did not close and we had time to do several attempts on the boss, probably 30-40 minutes worth or something. I have no clue if this is a bug or w/e or how to reproduce it. On my attempts after that one i assumed it to be normal behaviour and thought that once you get to hte last stage you have whatever time is left on the ~90minutes you get when you first pop the lure. Needless to say, I assumed wrong and i have never seen the lack of timer repeat itself on the last stage. This might actually be a good way to make the raid more accessible if that's the goal, let people continue to fight the last boss with no timer, although perhaps after the timer expires the second chest will no longer spawn or something. It would at least give people a chance to practice the fight.
    Last edited by Amshala; 03-24-2015 at 04:42 PM.

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    I might say it's too late m8, people already get used to do only SOL and habits are hard to quit, people are like sheep following the crowd, i don't think SOL can be done without effort or anything, you still need 1k hit and the dps a raid brings, but it's probably the easier one of the 3. Here is a plan B, make Sea of Ladon, PP and the other one which i forgot, rotate weekly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by MisakaMikoto View Post
    PS: One my guild member has said that my guild have did this 10 times, and 9 of those 10 times droped earings, so im not sure what is wrong with this drop rate, or is it related to that more guild members = higher drop rate?
    It's RNG. Ran 5, got 3 earrings, and 2 terrible essences out of the 2nd chest.


    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    I think it's fine how it is and encourages people to learn to be better at playing this game.

    OP's argument here is that it drops BIS earrings, so he should be able to pug it easily whenver it's the daily.

    Shall we suggest reducing the difficulty of the new raid as well using the same argument? Why not just give a BIS piece in the daily box, nice and easy.

    Only thing I can suggest doing to make it more PUG friendly (as a person who leads PUGS of this RR) is to add mechanic similar to the nightmare rift Junctions that give you a chance between stages that have timers to explain the next fight without wasting valuable time on said timer. If you want to go all out and make it even more pug friendly, give the adds on the final stage unique names so that focus targetting macros can be made for interrupts.
    You clearly did not understand what I intended to say, despite me making it quite evident. But I'll bite:

    1. "I think it's fine how it is and encourages people to learn to be better at playing this game."
    Has not been the premise of Rift since original Laethys. Look at SoL.

    2. "OP's argument here is that it drops BIS earrings, so he should be able to pug it easily whenver it's the daily."
    My argument was it is impossible to consistently build groups for this (not just PuGs, even guildmates are hesitant of spending 30+ mins doing this Rift for a chance at earring). Thus something needs to be done to bring this in line with Sea of Ladon so it can be completed an equivalent frequency. I have been one of the few NA players to create PuGs for this Rift and clear it in a reasonable time, and the first one to PuG-lead it successfully through all the initial bugs it released with. I don't need to "be able to pug it easily", I can pug it just fine assuming I have the people.

    3. "Shall we suggest reducing the difficulty of the new raid as well using the same argument? Why not just give a BIS piece in the daily box, nice and easy."
    They already did, in a weekly box. Have you been around for the four weeks of free raid loot, mate?
    Also I proposed two options, not just "reduce the difficulty".

    Since you brought up the analogy, it is like saying Threngar will drop epics and relics at an equal chance, despite it being a cornerstone boss and significantly harder than the rest.
    If that's the case, why would you waste time progressing MS, when you can just stop at Yrl, get those relics and heart, and move to TF and focus on other loot options and more mark gain?
    ^ That's my argument.

    Ergo, either gut the mechanics and keep the chance (or drop it for all I care) or keep the difficulty but make completing worth it. Not sure what's the problem in requesting that.
    Last edited by Solaxys; 03-24-2015 at 11:43 AM.

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    It's very clear in your OP that you want the BIS earrings specifically be easier to obtain. The 2 sections with proposed changes are effectively 1. Nerf the mechanics of the fight and 2. Make the earrings drop more often. How is that not making them easier to obtain?

    As for weekly boxes, no clue what tha'ts all about, maybe some pay 2 win patron stuff? If they do hand out raid gear in weekly boxes that's pretty silly, but whatever another topic I guess.

    I find it hilarious that you complain about how long it takes to fill this yet just yesterday I saw you posting a LFM asking for Ungolok achievement. What you are doing to recruit is making it take longer to fill, because you are filtering out a large segment of the population. Maybe they should just make Ungolok easier to kill so that more people PM you with Ungolok kill achievements when you pug DM, thus your raid will fill faster?


    1. "I think it's fine how it is and encourages people to learn to be better at playing this game."
    Has not been the premise of Rift since original Laethys. Look at SoL.
    You say this, but you aren't acknowledging that they put BIS earrings behind this raid rift, meaning there is an incentive for players to learn to do this rift, thus they are encouraged to get better as players since you can't just stand in one spot and repeatedly press a macro. You cannot get teh earrings in SoL, thus there is less incentive there to do that rift in terms of loot. If they dont want to get better and have a chance to get earrings that's their own perogative, I personally would have probably not tried this rift until I got other things done if there wasn't potential for the earrings, thus at least a portion of hte playerbase is encouraged I would say.

    Essentially, they put the carrot on the stick, but some people think there's too much stick. That's fine, however I think the stick is fine and I feel no resent for expressing my opinion.

    Since you brought up the analogy, it is like saying Threngar will drop epics and relics at an equal chance, despite it being a cornerstone boss and significantly harder than the rest.
    If that's the case, why would you waste time progressing MS, when you can just stop at Yrl, get those relics and heart, and move to TF and focus on other loot options and more mark gain?
    ^ That's my argument.
    If tha'ts your argument then where are you moving on to after DM to get better earrings?

    Either way, I'm fine with making the earrings drop more often or w/e, but that is not soley what this thread is about.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reishawastaken View Post
    i don't think SOL can be done without effort or anything, you still need 1k hit and the dps a raid brings, but it's probably the easier one of the 3. Here is a plan B, make Sea of Ladon, PP and the other one which i forgot, rotate weekly.

    SoL can be done easily with less than 1k hit. I took sub-level 65s from my guild the first time we tried it just for fun and so people can see the fight, we were able to down depth hunter and probably would have completed the entire rift, the issue was not hit rating, it was that the tank was dying excessively.

    I've also done it on my mage with 950 hit (as healer) and 975 hit (as dps). I was able to do high 40s as dps which is more than sufficient for this rift (though of course, not ideal). I very rarely saw "resist" with 975 hit.

    I'ts also not necessary to have an entire raid, I've done it with as little as 12 people and can guarantee that we could have done it with less, plenty of time left on the timers. I'd be willing to bet the raid "could" be done with just 2 tanks and a couple healers, mabye 3 healers (provided they had the skill for it) by taking the bosses to all 4 cannons instead of just using the 2. That's just speculation though, but you certanily do not need the dps from a 20 man raid to do SoL. I had a look at riftmeter twice out of curiosity and both times the cannons were registering over 300k dps combined for 2 of them.

    The suggestion you make of a weekly rotation is interesting though. Would certainly add some variety to this game, I haven't done planecrawler in probalby 3 weeks now or something. However, I would imagine that a weekly rotation like that would lead to many calls for nerfs to both planecrawler and TDM so that those that are used to rolling their face across the keyboard in SoL can get their precious essences. Still though, I personally like your idea quite a bit.
    Last edited by Amshala; 03-24-2015 at 12:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    Honestly you are just backpedalling now and trying to prove what I said as being wrong in vain.

    It's very clear in you OP that you want the BIS earrings specifically be easier to obtain.
    "while both Planecrawler Project and The Darkest Magic take ~20-30 minutes to fill at primetime. It is rather impossible to even account for any repeat sessions of these two raid rifts in comparison to the water one."

    "Either of these changes can help with getting more people actively doing this raid rift, though the 2nd option is the more tantalizing one."

    "And as someone who wants to min-max their character, it is rather aggravating to deal with the uphill of recruiting (outside of when it is DRR) for this particular raid rift when no one prefers or commits to do it. "

    "It is of no surprise then that there is at least 3 groups of SoL running during peak hours and at least 20 being attempted on a daily basis, while barely 2-4 per week, if at all, of TDM. "

    "Yet again, people would choose SoL over TDM. "

    Backpedalling? Reading comprehension that bad mate?

    I honestly just want people doing this rift more SO I can have a chance at getting this earring. The only reason why no one attempts it is because SoL is significantly easier to do, and the earring (or a chance at it) by itself is not worth it put oneself through the torture of TDM (It is only 10 AP more than PVP earring).

    Yet you are here bickering at me telling me I only want this 'cause I want an earring handed to me. Even Krug admits this Rift needs to be tuned down.

    Quit while you are behind.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    As for weekly boxes, no clue what tha'ts all about, maybe some pay 2 win patron stuff? If they do hand out raid gear in weekly boxes that's pretty silly, but whatever another topic I guess.
    Sparkle boxes. Not patron. Go google it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    I find it hilarious that you complain about how long it takes to fill this yet just yesterday I saw you posting a LFM asking for Ungolok achievement. What you are doing to recruit is making it take longer to fill, because you are filtering out a large segment of the population. Maybe they should just make Ungolok easier to kill so that more people PM you with Ungolok kill achievements when you pug DM, thus your raid will fill faster?
    And make the Rift take 45-60 mins? So to farm, lets say 5 Rifts, I have to spend 5 hrs + recruitment time? Ya... I got a life, and a job, and school. I was in the raid run by Dozs, Betacarotene, and Decarabia yesterday who were recruiting with no achievement. Of the 5 rifts ran with them, on separate occasions, two failed, 3 took an hour to finish and everyone was disgusted thereafter and didn't want to do them.

    Here's more statistics: Dosz raid took 35 mins to recruit for. Betacarotene took 26 mins to recruit for and 15 mins to fill ~3 post for the 2nd run. Decarabia took ~1 hr, 2 mins to recruit for the first and couldn't get enough for the 2nd.

    I was the only one who ran the raid rift, four times, and kept the turnover to a minimum of 5 players per Rift. I know what I recruit for. Oh here the's funny part, I took longer to recruit 20 people than it took to clear the 4 rifts combined (20-25 mins per).

    Moreover, and quite a few can confirm this, I have let in non-Ungolok achievement players in (4 per raid), to introduce the Rift to them even if their gear level/DPS level was not up to par - EVERY RIFT. We had a player die to every mechanic in the raid, doing 0 HPS and 0 DPS ultimately, they had no achievement, but I kept them around because they could finish DRR at the least as we had the carry potential.

    Don't talk with your shoe in your mouth mate. Get some evidence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    You say this, but you aren't acknowledging that they put BIS earrings behind this raid rift, meaning there is an incentive for players to learn to do this rift, thus they are encouraged to get better as players since you can't just stand in one spot and repeatedly press a macro. You cannot get teh earrings in SoL, thus there is less incentive there to do that rift in terms of loot. If they dont want to get better and have a chance to get earrings that's their own perogative, I personally would have probably not tried this rift until I got other things done if there wasn't potential for the earrings, thus at least a portion of hte playerbase is encouraged I would say.

    Essentially, they put the carrot on the stick, but some people think there's too much stick. That's fine, however I think the stick is fine and I feel no resent for expressing my opinion.
    (And people don't really want to be better; they are okay where they are. If they wanted to be better, they would be better. This game is not difficult.)
    I don't care if anyone else wants to do it or not, sure that is their prerogative. But everyone is bottlenecked into doing SoL and for a rift that needs twenty people to do, it takes insanely forever to recruit for it on a non-DRR day (and I don't have all day, maybe you do), let alone farm it.
    They are not encouraged enough, clearly, ergo this thread. This Rift has been out long enough and everyone knows that it drops earrings, yet there has been no trend shift. Keep up, mate.
    Again, +10 AP earrings, on a chance, aren't worth others time. I have got ALL OTHER LOOT I can from an open environment but this one. And trying to get it has shown me the above data that I addressed. What are you coming at? Your own opinion? I am coming with what I have seen over the past 2 months, and how it is shaping up to be and even have a developer backing me. .

    And please share your opinion. Don't be a ***** and shove your own words in my mouth though.
    "I think the Rift is fine." <- opinion
    "I think the Rift is fine, the OP is just fishing for easier earrings [even though nothing above stated that to be the case]" <- *****, pls.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    If tha'ts your argument then where are you moving on to after DM to get better earrings?
    Considering HK is releasing in 2 weeks? Ya that is where I am gonna go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    Either way, I'm fine with making the earrings drop more often or w/e, but that is not soley what this thread is about.
    Actually this thread is suggestions regarding how to get more people doing this Rift, not about nerfing it or making the earrings drop more.
    Those were MY suggestions to fixing the problem. If you have something better, let everyone know.

    And inducing timers in between each phase is a terrible idea, artificially increasing the time to complete the Rift. Again not everyone has all day to farm a Rift.
    ^ my "opinion".


    Seriously, if you want this more watered down, here you go:

    Problem: SoL is the current go-to RR, and TDM is hard to recruit for (Even internally from a guild who rather not do it). This has been the issue for it since release.
    Specifically, there is usually one group of RR spam of SoLs going (or multiple) and that is 20 less people that are available to do TDM. In Rift where the population is so thin that everyone is scared it will break, that is significant.
    Reason: SoL is incredibly easy and much faster and easier to do. The chance to get a minimal upgrade earring while completing a much harder rift is not amicable to most, and thus opt to do the easier rift and go for essences.
    Solution: Nerf the RR or increase the drop rate of the earring (if not 100% on the 2nd chest) so the RR is attempted more or I can entice more people to do it.

    Let me know if you need more help, I have a gold star waiting for you.
    Last edited by Solaxys; 03-24-2015 at 12:56 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solaxys View Post
    "Either of these changes can help with getting more people actively doing this raid rift, though the 2nd option is the more tantalizing one."
    Can you honestly not see that when people read what you wrote in the OP, both the suggested changes imply making earrings easier to get?

    Sparkle boxes. Not patron. Go google it.
    Saying that is enough, I know what you are talking about and no I wasn't level 65 when those were available. They are also no where near the same thing as daily log in boxes.

    The hostility in your last post is very obvious, I would ask that you take a more civil tone, chances are other people are much smarter than what your ego may lead you to believe.

    Congrats on having a dev back you. By posting in the forum with suggested changes your changes are absolutely open to criticism and opposing viewpoints, just the same as the developers posts. This is supposed to be a discussion and not a bickering match where one person touts his horn about how right he is.

    "I think the Rift is fine, the OP is just fishing for easier earrings [even though nothing above stated that to be the case]" <- *****, pls.
    If you are going to quote me, try not altering what you are quoting in a silly attempt to try to insult/discredit me. This is what I wrote:
    "OP's argument here is that it drops BIS earrings, so he should be able to pug it easily whenver it's the daily."

    How do you not see that this is what your OP is all about? You want it to be easier to PUG don't you?

    Considering HK is releasing in 2 weeks? Ya that is where I am gonna go.
    That content isn't even out yet and are you certain there will be earrings that drop? I sure am not, if there are maybe it is justified to make TDM easier. A developer would certainly have more insight into this than I, and likely will make decisions based on this.

    And inducing timers in between each phase is a terrible idea, artificially increasing the time to complete the Rift. Again not everyone has all day to farm a Rift.
    ^ my "opinion".
    For those of us that take inexperienced players a mintue or two would be fantastic to make sure everyone is on the same page and understands their role for the next stage. If you can't deal with an added 20 seconds per timer stage (total of 1 minute), then that's fine, it's only a suggestion that will make the rift more tolerable for other people from my viewpoint, perhaps not you though. I'm not suggesting a lengthy timer that can't be bypassed, I"m suggesting a mechanic similar to junctions in nightmare rifts where you are given a set time (12 mins in NMR, doesn't have to be the same for TDM) that you can bypass entirely (turn the junctions).
    Last edited by Amshala; 03-24-2015 at 02:02 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    Can you honestly not see that when people read what you wrote in the OP, both the suggested changes imply making earrings easier to get?
    Not when you give people the benefit of the doubt. And the fact that I lead the argument with "not enough people doing it" and iterated it after every reason and solution and concluded it as such. And yes, making the earring 100% drop means everyone will do it even if the bloody rift is as difficult as SoL was at release, ergo my adjective of "tantalizing".

    I mean if you want to read between the lines and assume my intentions, then be my guest. Do not treat it as fact, because "making the earrings easier to get" was not my motive. Even if the rift was made easier and the drop chance reduced, I would've been fine because I would at least get more people doing it.

    I have 25 TDM lures in my bag and I was willing to run all of them last Saturday. I only managed to get through 3 in 4 hrs because no one wanted to do them. I ran 6 of them when the bug in P4 was still there that raid-wiped everyone on interrupt or off interrupt. I am sincere in my efforts to get the earring. If I could solo the raid rift, I would do it as often as I can even if it was that difficult or the earring rare (216 CQ chests netted me my first heart, and I have not complained once).

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    The hostility in your last post is very obvious, I would ask that you take a more civil tone, chances are other people are much smarter than what your ego may lead you to believe.
    Congrats on having a dev back you. By posting in the forum with suggested changes your changes are absolutely open to criticism and opposing viewpoints, just the same as the developers posts. This is supposed to be a discussion and not a bickering match where one person touts his horn about how right he is.
    Trust me from what I read, "much smarter" is definitely not you.
    You could have just as well said "The Rift is fine and the proposed changes would make the earrings easier to obtain, which I am against." And to that, I would have replied, "Ah fair enough. Perhaps they could lower the drop rate if suggestion 1 goes through."

    But you said, my intent behind these changes is that I could get earrings easier.

    See the difference? No? I guess not.
    Civility leaves the building when you attack me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    How do you not see that this is what your OP is all about? You want it to be easier to PUG don't you?
    Yet again. No. I want the Rift to be run at a higher frequency by more players in the game. My suggestions were to make it easier to PuG, but I don't "want it", make SoL harder, or make it so that only one type of RR can be run every day and rotate it each day.

    If those are better, feasible, sure; but I assumed they are not so I did not suggest.


    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    That content isn't even out yet and are you certain there will be earrings that drop? I sure am not, if there are maybe it is justified to make TDM easier. A developer would certainly have more insight into this than I, and likely will make decisions based on this.
    A new tier? No earrings? What?

    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    For those of us that take inexperienced players a mintue or two would be fantastic to make sure everyone is on the same page and understands their role for the next stage. If you can't deal with an added 20 seconds per timer stage (total of 1 minute), then that's fine, it's only a suggestion that will make the rift more tolerable for other people from my viewpoint, perhaps not you though. I'm not suggesting a lengthy timer that can't be bypassed, I"m suggesting a mechanic similar to junctions in nightmare rifts where you are given a set time (12 mins in NMR, doesn't have to be the same for TDM) that you can bypass entirely (turn the junctions).
    Lol. I don't even want to address this considering, yet again, you feel like you know me.

    Again, opine if you want. Do not think you know me or pretend to know what I want out of this.
    Last edited by Solaxys; 03-25-2015 at 10:12 AM.

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